build Forza-E

[EarlyBird]

Just ordered from Hyperflight.😊

[Ron Gray]

Nice 👌 

[Konrad]

Keep good mechanics in the back of your mind when setting up and assembling the model and you’ll end up with fun ship.

 

Getting the tail servos in place  can be a trick.  I find that the manual is one of the few places the model/ kit is lacking.  So look around for how others have solved the problem of installing the servo on the tail. This is one place where it would wise to use the best and smallest hardware. I know Aeroic doesn’t think their models deserve MKS servos. But I disagree, I think some of the smaller and higher priced MKS servos would be appropriate. 

[EarlyBird]

Delivery today 🙂

[Konrad]

I’m thinking of Carl Simon’s Anticipation 😉

[EarlyBird]

Delivered and unpacked, WOW, I have to lay down now.

 

Not a lot of weight for the money but I guess that's the clever bit. 

 

Steve

[EarlyBird]

First flapper servo mounted on its servo plate. 

And the screws filed down.

 

 

Steve

[EarlyBird]

Repeated for the second flap. 

 

 

Steve

[Konrad]

Its been awhile, but aren't the flap (Inboard surface) servos to be mirror images of each other?

 

Does the kit come with optional 30mm x 30mm servo trays? (I believe you are useing 30mm x 35mm trays)

Edited April 4 by Konrad

[EarlyBird]

Yes the flaps have to be mirror images because of the position of the control horns, which means I cannot use a Y lead and I will need a seven channel receiver.

[Nick Cripps]

Then you'll have to flip one over in its mounting plate (I assume the pushrods are the same length).

[Ron Gray]

2 hours ago, EarlyBird said:

Yes the flaps have to be mirror images because of the position of the control horns, which means I cannot use a Y lead and I will need a seven channel receiver.

I much prefer having separate channels for each control surface. You can always use a PWM to SBus converter rather than buying a ‘larger’ Rx it also has the advantage of just one servo connection to a fuselage mounted Rx.

[EarlyBird]

Wing servos all mounted on their plates, the right way around I hope. 

 

 

 

 

 

Next is to make up the control rods and hopefully they will be the same length. 🤣

 

Steve

[Konrad]

Yikes, “Y” connectors should never be contemplated for this class of glider. The power elegance, grace and power of these ships come from the ability to independently drive/mix the servos. This is how one gets camber changing, progressive ailerons (flaps moving like ailerons), ailerons moving like spoilers and rudder being able to move with or against the ailerons. This model will need 7 independent channels/outputs.

 

I hope you have just placed the servos in the wing and I’m not too late with this. For the flaps I strongly recommend that you use an external bearing mount for the flaps. This is to give the output shaft the much needed support saving the gearbox when landing on them. And you will land on the flaps at times!

 

If the plastic servo tray is properly designed there should be a micro ledge that should be encapsulated with epoxy. I strongly recommend against using CA to glue the trays to the inner wing skin. This is because the brittle bond is easy to shatter and the heat and shrinkage will distort the wing skins. I go into a bit of detail on how to install servo trays here. The thread had a bit more detail in setting up wing and tail servos. I think it is a good read.

https://forums.modelflying.co.uk/index.php?/topic/61778-aeroic-alpenbrise-157-konrad’s-gag-4-meter-f3f-racer/&do=findComment&comment=1034867

 

Also Hammond and I have a detailed thread on tray installation here.

https://forum.alofthobbies.com/index.php?threads/servorahmen-ids-servo-mounts-etc-step-by-step-install.198/page-3

 

Another thread .

https://forum.alofthobbies.com/index.php?threads/servo-tray-mounting.1041/

 

I actually like to use the servo arm and push rod to aid in placing the servo tray properly in the wing. Are you aware that the best practice is to set the servo are so that servo neutral (1.5µs) places the control surface in the middle of its anticipated travel. Not in profile with the  wing!

 

To help us help you can you tell us a bit about your experiance with high performance gliders?

 

P.S.

Are the flap servos clear of the spar web to allow the arm to pull the flaps up to around 15° to 20° past profile?

Edited April 5 by Konrad

[Konrad]

7 hours ago, Ron Gray said:

I much prefer having separate channels for each control surface. You can always use a PWM to SBus converter rather than buying a ‘larger’ Rx it also has the advantage of just one servo connection to a fuselage mounted Rx.

With this configuration of ship even using F-Bus/S-Bus you will need two connectors as the wings are two piece and shoulder mounted. Come to think of it you would need 2 converters, one for each wing.  I like the FrSky F-bus servo for this type of ship. Yes, one will in all likelihood need to tune the servo amp for the flaps. But this is generally easy with Ethos. 

[Ron Gray]

Even with a 2 piece wing it’s only 2 connections rather than 4 and you can go with a ‘smaller’ (as in fewer channels) Rx.

[Konrad]

And 2 converters to allow the serial signal to be decoded in each wing. To me if using serial protocols it is best to keep them native across the whole wiring system and use S-Bus or F-Bus compliant servos.

 

With PWM servos and the use of the Multiplex connector you are only making and breaking two connections. 

 

Now we can discussed the benefit of a common bus bar arcitecture in saving wiring weight and hence nose weight.

Edited April 5 by Konrad

[EarlyBird]

Third time lucky and I am almost there. 

 

Unfortunately the keeper will not fit and allow the servo to work, a bit more thinking required I think. 

 

Steve

[Dickw]

9 minutes ago, EarlyBird said:

Third time lucky and I am almost there. 

 

 

Unfortunately the keeper will not fit and allow the servo to work, a bit more thinking required I think. 

 

Steve

Would it work if the bend was the other way?

Actually, ball joint, clevis, or Z bend would be my preferred options for that location.

 

Dick

[Ron Gray]

Wrong connector for that location! Look at Konrad’s posts on the subject or if they’re a bit OTT for you then Peter Garsden’s Wortz build where he shows how he modified the clevis to fit a similar configuration.

 

 

[Ron Gray]

The alternative is to just have the 90° bend in the pushrod but attach a piece of thin wire to the pushrod which acts as a ‘whisker keeper’. Used a lot on DLGs where space is at a premium.

[Outrunner]

EB it looks like the pushrod will foul the servo, or perhaps it's just the camera giving a distorted view.

I've used Rons suggestion of a "whisker" keeper many times. Light, cheap, simple and very effective.

[Nigel Dell]

If I have limited space and cannot use ball links or clevises then a 90 degree bend with correct size brass or Ali tube glued on with cyano (carefully) which is easily removable.

[Konrad]

 

Steve, 

Please take this in the spirit it is given. Most molded gliders are high performance model and as such the designers and OEMs assume that the end customer has some experience with multi surfaced winged gliders. The Aeroic Forza is far too nice and advanced to be using as a glider trainer. Please but it a side until you have some experience. Might I suggest a model or two from firms like Blejzky Models or Art Models. In the few post you have made in this thread it is clear to me that you need to gain some skills with geometry/mechanics, wire bending, wire harness construction and glider programing.  We wouldn’t move a pilot from a piston trainer into a Gripen or Eurofighter without a skill developing path using simpler less expensive aircraft. Please give this some thought. We all want to see you excel in this part of the hobby. If I’ve over stepped I apologize.

https://blejzyk.pl/en/

https://www.arthobby.com/

 

I’ve been looking at other low to mid cost brands and all seem to be lacking in adequate manuals. RCRCM seams to have more detailed manuals for their moldies  than Aeroic but I can’t in good conscience recommend any RCRCM model.

 

Not sure what Ron means by me going Over The Top. I hope it is an acknowledgment that I post in excruciating detail. Not that the execution of the solution is Over The Top. Please spend some time searching here on the RCM&E forum, Aloft Hobbies forum and RCGroups to get an idea of what is needed to assemble, set up and fly these high performance gliders. I do this a lot, as the manuals are generally atrocious.

 

P.S.

Most would agree that 6 servo gliders are some of the most advanced models out there. Particularly  when it comes to servo set up and radio programing. Then add the issues with motors and thrust lines and you are at another level of complexity.

 

[Ron Gray]

Of course there is the superglue method of retaining pushrods. After pushing the 90º bed through the servo arm apply a couple of drops of thin cyano to the wire and let it go off. Then apply a drop of medium cyan to the end of the wire. The thin cyan will wick into the pushrod / servo arm joint and will tack up any slack plus it will provide an excellent bearing surface, the med cyan will stop the pushrod coming off.