.. Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 7 now being reported to have perished & the pilot was indeed pulled out alive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 I was told they got him out but he died in hospital. Clearly there are mixed reports all over the place which is why I am happy to be corrected by anyone with confirmed information. We were told nothing over the tannoy at the show. Most likely due to the number of children and families present at the show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.. Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 Posted by Jon Harper on 22/08/2015 21:33:10: I was told they got him out but he died in hospital. Clearly there are mixed reports all over the place which is why I am happy to be corrected by anyone with confirmed information. We were told nothing over the tannoy at the show. Most likely due to the number of children and families present at the show. Indeed Jon , its just what the bbc have just reported . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno Racer Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 Very sad incident. BBC news (SW) just showed the road junction. Looked a mess. Condolences to those affected. My view is that it appears to be pilot error, insufficient altitude to start the manoeuvre, but AAIT will provide details. In my expeience pilot error is 90% of incident causes. It will be interesting to see what the sum of these last few (including Gnat and Spitfire ) incidents is, post investigation, with the CAA. I'm about to set up a company operating classic jets for jet experience flights (my Norwegian mate owns a vampire and T-33 and I will soon add a JP and we have access to other two seat vampires and L29s). Although not engaged with air shows, albeit my mate flys his at air shows), it may cause operational limitations. The UK-I hope not. I hope this sad trend of loss, both aircraft and people doesn't continue. Very sad summer for aviation this year. Edited By Reno Racer on 22/08/2015 21:41:35 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 Bbc states that the pilot is in hospital "fightibg for his life" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 I hope he makes it. Both for him and to help find answers to the crash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Kearney Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 Posted by kc on 22/08/2015 20:27:59: Makes you wonder what else they censor. Censoring the moment of death in a video or other media is common practice with the BBC. Documented in their guidelines for all to see, here. Section 7.4.39. Beyond official AAIB use I can't see how it helps anybody else's understanding of the story, to actually see the moment of impact. My thoughts are with the families of the victims of this tragedy. r. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 I too was at the show and it was a horrible thing to witness. Ironically it was only yesterday whilst slope soaring I was talking to someone about the show and commented that I'd been fortunate enough to have never seen a crash at an airshow. I was surprised when I noticed the flaps, whilst looking through my photos from the day half an hour or so ago. I agree with much of what Jon H says in his posts above. From my viewpoint the aircraft was quite nose-high as it disappeared out of sight. I'll post only that shot below, the rest of the sequence are in my photo album "Shoreham crash" on here for anyone who chooses to view them. My thoughts are with the family and friends of those who lost their lives today, also those of the pilot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avtur Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Posted by John Privett on 22/08/2015 23:41:05: I was surprised when I noticed the flaps, whilst looking through my photos from the day half an hour or so ago. There is much discussion about the position of the flaps over on the 'pprune' website. There is input from several experienced pilots who have flown Hunters and they confirm the use of flaps would be correct for this type of maneuver. The widespread availability of pictures and videos so soon after the event and shared very quickly via the internet and social media is a sign of the times. While some may consider this to be inappropriate (and its probably to do with context and the comments made) I'm sure the availability of the images will help with the accident investigation. Edited By avtur on 23/08/2015 00:03:09 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Posted by avtur on 23/08/2015 00:02:21: I'm sure the availability of the images will help with the accident investigation. I'm sure you're right. As well as the thousands of amateurs such as myself shooting photos and video, one of the commercial video companies was there filming. So I'm sure there will be broadcast-quality (HD probably) video of the incident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Posted by avtur on 23/08/2015 00:02:21: Posted by John Privett on 22/08/2015 23:41:05: I was surprised when I noticed the flaps, whilst looking through my photos from the day half an hour or so ago. There is much discussion about the position of the flaps over on the 'pprune' website. There is input from several experienced pilots who have flown Hunters and they confirm the use of flaps would be correct for this type of maneuver. Indeed, that thread obviously has experienced pilots contributing to it, some with Hunter experience. Their general concensus seems to be that the top of the loop/reversal was just too low to enable a safe pullout with height to spare, but obviously the investigating authorities will utilise all the footage available to find out the cause(s) in due course. RIP to all those who lost their lives; a tragic day for aviation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jez Saunders Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 No expert in any way but could there simply have been engine failure beyond a point of return in the manoeve ? H&S will be involved of course and lessons will be learnt, but hope there is not an over reaction to this tragedy stopping aicraft giving pleasure to many people. My condolences go out to all effected by this awful event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingman Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Planes TV filmed the whole maneuver from start to finish which I linked to in my thread at the time however I see that the clip has now been made private, unsurprisingly - you could see that the aircraft appeared to stall at the bottom of the loop - the wings rocked - and it just mushed into the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jez Harris 1 Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Saw this on another forum....truly shocking. Jez Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony F Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Jez that is an amazing horrible photo. If the pilot survives that then that would be truly miraculous. Also amazing that more were not killed. I have been a spectator at airshows since 1980 and have been lucky not to see this happen on my visits. Sadly in the air force I witnessed 4 accidents and this reminds me of a buccaneer crash at Lossiemouth. Heart out to all involved. TonyEdited By Tony F on 23/08/2015 09:45:47 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Jez I don't think the engine failed, there appears to be significant efflux from it in the photo my friend took and in one of the videos it can be heard as running although not at max power. If my memory is right, when I have seen this loop before he usually takes a track at 45 degrees to the display axis heading before pulling up into a barrel roll type maneuver that brings him back towards the crowd and eventually away again on a parallel track to his entry point but at the other end of the airfield. This 45 degree entry track is pretty much the angle from the display line that the road follows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban8 Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 It's a fine line that exists between reporting the facts and sensationalism and I think that the decision not to show the moment of impact was, in this case, the correct one. It depends on the circumstances and subject matter. The 9/11 attacks in New York showed the impact and aftermath of the two passenger jets on the World Trade Center and by showing the events in full detail, gave the whole world (quite rightly) a clear understanding of the heinousness of the terrorists actions - a news story that was a universe away from any type of genuine accident. I've been going to airshows ever since a child, so almost 50 years now and I've witnessed a number of fatal accidents in that time. Safety at modern airshows is far stricter than in the past and the routines performed by the 'planes is very carefully chosen to put safety as the top priority rather than spectacle, as was the case in the 50s & 60s. We all feel for the losses of the bereaved families, who after all, had nothing to do with the airshow itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area 51 Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Truly a tragic event, my thoughts are with all those sadly affected by it.. A few days ago I found this utterly fascinating to view.. **LINK** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban8 Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Posted by Area 51 on 23/08/2015 10:34:14: Truly a tragic event, my thoughts are with all those sadly affected by it.. A few days ago I found this utterly fascinating to view.. **LINK** The perfect illustration of zero perception of safety for the crowd. If the rotor blades or tail rotor had made contact with the ground........? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area 51 Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Yes C8, my thoughts exactly.. I am totally unsure why PIC elected to continue! Also - I'm guessing some of the "spray" you can see as it approaches, is actually FUEL being dumped!! You couldn't make it up could you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony F Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 I'd say the spray is a fuel leak caused by the impact with the undercarriage puncturing the fuselage. Did I see them disembarking passengers after the incident ? Wow.Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Posted by Wingman on 23/08/2015 07:47:19: ... and it just mushed into the ground. Which is exactly how it appeared to me at the time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Concorde Speedbird Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Such a tragic event. My condolences go to the family and friends of those who lost their lives, and I hope that the injured people make a full recovery. It has not been a good year for airshows, hopefully things get better from now on. CS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cymaz Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Posted by Tony F on 23/08/2015 11:27:07: I'd say the spray is a fuel leak caused by the impact with the undercarriage puncturing the fuselage. Did I see them disembarking passengers after the incident ? Wow. Tony And then spectators walking towards a crippled flying aircraft....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josip Vrandecic -Mes Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 @ Dear John Privett, I looked at your album 'Shoreham Crash', which it explained much of this tragic accident. Photos are very professional and useful for future investigation. Thanks and Rgds Jo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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