Peter Christy Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 Well, in the States, anyway! **LINK** From what I hear of American lawyers, this could keep the whole thing tied up in knots for years! I doubt if a similar approach would be effective here, unfortunately.... -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowerman Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 I don't know about that but when Human Rights lawyers backed with legal aid (tax payers) money get started !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Chaddock Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 I suppose the issue is if the FAA have been given a "nod and wink" by the administration then their lawyers (with the government behind them) will be able to tie everyone else up for years, meanwhile the legislation will stand! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perttime Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 http://droneinsider.org/new-easa-drone-regulations-threaten-kill-uk-european-drone-industry/ suggests that there might be a couple of weeks to influence the powers that be in Europe by emailing MPs, MEPs and EASA. For EASA they supply [email protected] Edited By perttime on 01/10/2016 17:32:50 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Berriman Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 I noticed on TV this morning some deterent for drones it was a net fired from a large party popper mechanism Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisB Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 Have read the news article posted by the OP, I agree that they are trying to crack a nut with a hammer and will leave nothing to eat at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sticky fingers Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 On the bbc news this mornig too was an electronic device to combat 'drones ' if that get into the wrong hands all of us on 2.4 will be in trouble,maybe drones could fly on another frequency?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sticky fingers Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 Ok you geeks out there how do I get rid of 3 overpostings? Mods Help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete B Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 Very appropriate user name you have there, SF...... Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sticky fingers Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 Thank you Peteb, usually use a desktop and it behaves itself impeccably, but this tab can be apain Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 I've found this site can be very slow to respond to a posting. If nothing seems to be happening, check the activity indicator on your browser and if it is moving, just wait and don't hit the "Add Posting" button again - it will eventually complete...each time you hit the button during this time, it adds a duplicate post. Edited By Martin Harris on 01/10/2016 22:12:32 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete B Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 It's keeping up a head of steam that's the problem, Martin - DA's just issued we mods with bigger shovels.... On the topic in hand, I don't think any of us can risk this legislation going through in its present form without making some representation. If modellers just accept this as a fait accompli, then surely it will have enormous implications for the future of RC modelling in Europe... Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted October 1, 2016 Share Posted October 1, 2016 Read that much and that many links Pete, i haven't a clue where we are at present, i don't do facebook and the likes so don't know if owt's been done like the online petitions for parliament ? done my own e mail to MP but to be honest i'm that confused i don't know which laws/rules to object to John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete B Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 I can sympathise, John. The BMFA page is probably the best place to get a summary of the proposals. EASA seem to have adopted the position of effectively proposing to ban model flying across Europe - but if enough interest and opposition is shown, they'll water down the proposal until a workable compromise is reached - all being well...... Have a look at the link perttime has posted above and instead of reading 'drone', substitute it with 'my favourite fixed-wing RC model'. That's the reality facing us - no more home-built models >250g - unless you are prepared to jump through many hoops. I'm not convinced by the value of petitions - the Govt scheme requires 100000 signatures before Parliament would consider discussing an issue and that is not going to happen. Far too many of those petitions are ill-conceived, ill-prepared and, frankly, illiterate so I'm sure they are largely ignored by anyone with any clout..... Some might point to the ' 3 year transitional arrangement' - which may give club-flyers a bit of breathing space - but what about the non-club flyers who have their own flying site - or open-space slope soaring venues? That'll be dead from day one if these rules are implemented. If we'd been regularly killing passers-by or bringing down over-flying aircraft, I'd accept the need for regulation - but that just isn't the case, is it? This is a case of EASA flexing its muscle because it can - or perhaps there is pressure being placed upon them by the likes of Amazon, etc, to acquire the currently unregulated airspace?. Security/terrorism aspect? Utterly pointless - no amount of legislation will prevent anyone from doing something nasty if they set their mind to it. The legislation will only affect those who wish to pursue a peaceful and absorbing hobby. If the model trade puts together a reasoned argument - and everyone in the model industry must surely be extremely worried for their future if this comes to pass - the best we can do is support it. A letter/email to your MP has to be worth doing, if only to give them a heads-up as to the existence of this hobby and the Draconian measures being proposed. Emailing EASA (liink in perttime's post above) has to be worthwhile, too - if only to put them on notice that their proposals won't go unchallenged. I'm not given to histrionics but I do wonder now about the increasingly authoritarian nature of government organisations, elected and non-elected, together with their apparent manipulation by global companies - it's going to end in tears for some, I'm sure.... Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 Posted by Pete B - Moderator on 02/10/2016 00:25:24: ..... A letter/email to your MP has to be worth doing, if only to give them a heads-up as to the existence of this hobby and the Draconian measures being proposed. Emailing EASA (liink in perttime's post above) has to be worthwhile, too - if only to put them on notice that their proposals won't go unchallenged. I'm not given to histrionics but I do wonder now about the increasingly authoritarian nature of government organisations, elected and non-elected, together with their apparent manipulation by global companies - it's going to end in tears for some, I'm sure.... Pete I've emailed EASA via their contact address for the prototype recommendation U[email protected], copying in my MP and local councillors - they send me enough spam so it seemed only fair. I've also copied it to the 7 West Midland MEPs with a suitable explanation. We all need to let EASA know how wrong this proposal is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Skilbeck Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 Posted by Pete B - Moderator on 02/10/2016 00:25:24: Some might point to the ' 3 year transitional arrangement' - which may give club-flyers a bit of breathing space - but what about the non-club flyers who have their own flying site - or open-space slope soaring venues? That'll be dead from day one if these rules are implemented. If we'd been regularly killing passers-by or bringing down over-flying aircraft, I'd accept the need for regulation - but that just isn't the case, is it? This is a case of EASA flexing its muscle because it can - or perhaps there is pressure being placed upon them by the likes of Amazon, etc, to acquire the currently unregulated airspace?. Pete There's probably more pressure coming from commercial airline pilots, if you read http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/550269-drones-threatening-commercial-c.html the vitriol after the reported drone strike near heathrow was quite strong, but the thread went quiet when it was reported to be a plastic bag. Unfortunately there's more drone near misses being reported everyday, some of them, i.e. drones at 17,000ft seem a bit suspicious but they are all recorded. I'm currently in the Middle East and Dubai airport was shutdown for 40 mins earlier in the week, because somebody was flying a drone nearby. But it's a bit like driving and talking/texting on a mobile, many people don't see anything wrong with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perttime Posted October 2, 2016 Share Posted October 2, 2016 Posted by Bob Cotsford on 02/10/2016 09:54:07:I've also copied it to the 7 West Midland MEPs with a suitable explanation. We all need to let EASA know how wrong this proposal is. There's no harm in spreading the message to more MEPs if you can work up the steam. There's something like 751 of them. After your local ones, all from your country, all from the Transport and Tourism Committee, all from the Civil Liberties Committee and maybe even all from the Internal Market Committee might be good additions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Dilly 1 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 By all means contact EASA , MPs and MEPs, but please whatever you do don't refer to model flying as 'a hobby'; it's a sport, in fact by far the most popular airsport in the country. In the UK the reognition of model flying as a sport puts us on a similar footing to every other sport when it comes to national and local authorities, specially when funding is involved, so let's use the right term for heaven's sake!. There are well over 500.000 model flyers in Europe and we've got to get this right. And by the way, there are likely to be more of us than just RC flyers who'll be affected; control-line and free flight, even down to chuck gliders, could get caught up in knee-jerk legislation. Just recall the Dangerous Dogs Act and the aftermath of Dunblane; some nut runs amok and shoots a load of school kids and the next thing we know is that owning a hand gun is illegal and the British Olympic pistol shooting team has to practice abroad. Hasn't made a scrap of difference as far as bad people having firearms is concerned, of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham R Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 I was in my very well known LMS on Saturday and spoke about our impending problem with EASA. They didn' t seem to know much about it and didn't seem that bothered. Perhaps the model trade need educating, after all their business could well be on the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 I'd venture that most model flyers on this forum are hobbyists first, even if they indulge in some competitive flying. There is room for both aspects and I'd hope that any forthcoming legislation isn't influenced to differentiate in allowing organised sporting activities rather than hobby flying as practised at most club fields! As Martin Dilley pointed out in relation to pistol shooting, sporting activities get no special treatment when hastily thought out legislation is applied! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerOC Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 May I just add another factor to this. You might have heard of a new project that has come to the UK called Men in Sheds. This is a project to get retired people involved in doing things and encouraging them to socialise with others because so many men retire, vegetate and die early deaths. Our club is largely retired men. We have 2 members who have recently had serious health issues. Both members have told me that they don't know how they would have coped with their situation without the help of other members and being able to get out and enjoy time with their mates doing something they love. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perttime Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Posted by Steve J on 03/10/2016 18:09:58: ... There seems to be an awful lot of hysteria on various forums about a prototype regulation that will have little effect on the average club flyer. Note that I have read the document, understood what it says and sent comments to EASA. Can you help a little? The document isn't exactly easy reading - and you say you understand it. What does it mean to - hobbyist club flyer - competitive aerobatics, scale or glider flyer - a guy who now legally flies a slope glider or electric model on public land, a member of a club or not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ashby - Moderator Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Posted by TigerOC on 03/10/2016 21:07:43: May I just add another factor to this. You might have heard of a new project that has come to the UK called Men in Sheds. This is a project to get retired people involved in doing things and encouraging them to socialise with others because so many men retire, vegetate and die early deaths. Our club is largely retired men. We have 2 members who have recently had serious health issues. Both members have told me that they don't know how they would have coped with their situation without the help of other members and being able to get out and enjoy time with their mates doing something they love. Rob Excellent point and a factor that's often overlooked when the hobby's benefits are counted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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