Spitfire takeoff accident at french airshow

[Colin Leighfield]

You can see how the prop hits the ground. The Griffon rotates clockwise from the front, opposite to the Merlin and as it strikes it twists the plane to the left. Tha massive torque effect is twisting the fuselage and the prop shatters. Dowty-Rotol Props had blades made from "Jablo", a compressed wood material and that is why pieces of prop are flying all over the place. No doubt the plane will be repaired but it is a major re-build. 

(As a side-note, "Rotol" is derived from "Rolls Royce" and "Bristol", because it was a collaborative effort between the two primary aero engine makers to ensure adequate supplies of propellers suitable for their engines, I believe).

I note that in my previous post I mentioned "South East Asia Air Corps". It was of course "Command", not "Corps". My apologies. 

 

 

Edited By Colin Leighfield on 12/06/2017 22:23:43

[Jon H]

Posted by Donald Fry on 12/06/2017 20:11:18:

Actually John, watch the pilot being dragged free at the end of the clip. It's fairly brutal. And at that point, some of the helpers run away. But, and I risk being hoisted by the word assume, he has arrived upside down, without hitting anything, from moderate speed. Given the ancient technology, the risk is to his feet, from the engine shifting..

If I were assessing that incident why would I expect serious injury. Ask him is a solution, look for blood pouring out, or shallow grunts, getting fainter are answers. But I would need a REALLY good reason why he will not survive to wait for the A team to arrive.

And fair does to the Turbulant rescuers. But they waded into waist deep water, to drag pilot and plane out. Whether they knew it or not, the risk was minimal. The Spitfire had, ( and I know nowt about full size aviation), 60 gallons of fuel on board? No water to put it out.

You are right, a hard ask as to what to do. Many years ago, I was on a management course, all arty farty, management styles, etc, but this sort of question came up. The discussion between me and a colleague became so heated, we were dragged apart. Just as well, he would have made mincemeat of me.

I was actually the most concerned about his neck/back as the canopy was well squished and there is a fuel tank between his feet and the engine. I did think that dragging him along the runway was not likely to be good for his health!

It does remind me of the case when black 6 crashed and the pilot asked to be left upside down while fuel leaked around him as he didnt want to cause more damage to the aircraft or upset the happy balance. If fire was considered unlikely in this case then it would have probably been better to hoist the tail up (assuming the pilots head was on the ground) and then leave it. I would have given the engine a good once over with an extinguisher from the outset too.

[J D 8]

I have recently retired from twenty eight years service as a Coastguard rescue officer. In an emergency situation where a casualty with possible spinal injury needs to be moved in a hurry [ in our case like the tide coming in ] then dragging the casualty along the ground is considered less likely to cause further injury to the spine than carrying without a stretcher and should be done by pulling on the clothing at the shoulders as another rescuer holds the head as straight as possible.

It is by no means an ideal method and is regarded as a last resort in a desperate situation. I would also have immediately used the extinguisher as well.

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Unless it's providing long lasting foam, wouldn't you run the risk of trying to fight a fire which starts a little later with an empty extinguisher?

[Jon H]

Posted by Martin Harris on 13/06/2017 14:35:26:

Unless it's providing long lasting foam, wouldn't you run the risk of trying to fight a fire which starts a little later with an empty extinguisher?

Ah but i would work on the basis that backup was on its way!

[Don Fry]

Rural France is rural. One day coming down the River Charente on my boat, I came across a busy bloke, and the reason was he had found a mororcyclist in the water. Between us we got him out. The busy bloke was an off duty fireman. So we started CPR. And help was 40 minutes coming. Big country.

And on reflection, I'm not so sure I should criticise those rescuers. I find the French a self reliant bunch.

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Posted by Jon Harper - Laser Engines on 13/06/2017 14:43:47:

Posted by Martin Harris on 13/06/2017 14:35:26:

Unless it's providing long lasting foam, wouldn't you run the risk of trying to fight a fire which starts a little later with an empty extinguisher?

Ah but i would work on the basis that backup was on its way!

Probably one of those situations where you only find out if you did the right thing when you have time to reflect after the event.

[ken anderson.]

forget about H/S,Risk Assessments and PC....... common sense will have went out the window and human nature will have taken over.......people wanting to help the pilot(fellow human) ....wrong in some eye's but they did what they thought correct at the time...hindsight and armchair judgement is a wonderful thing....sometimes.

ken Anderson...ne...1 .... my thoughts dept.

[The Wright Stuff]

Posted by ken anderson. on 13/06/2017 16:59:27:

forget about H/S,Risk Assessments and PC....... common sense will have went out the window and human nature will have taken over.......people wanting to help the pilot(fellow human) ....wrong in some eye's but they did what they thought correct at the time...hindsight and armchair judgement is a wonderful thing....sometimes.

ken Anderson...ne...1 .... my thoughts dept.

Indeed. The other way of looking at this is that I suspect that whatever the marshals had been trained to do in response, they wouldn't have been able to stop the crowd from rushing to help even if they had tried to!

[Chris Freeman 3]

At Oshkosh a number of years ago a famous pilot died in what I recall was a landing accident in a Sea Fury. One of the marshals wrote that he was one of the first to reach the overturned airframe and that that it took quite a while for emergency teams to arrive and get the body of the pilot out. The postmortem showed that the pilot had suffocated to death due to the angle of his head and neck in the inverted aircraft on the ground. Had those marshals done what these guys did, then that pilot would be alive today.

[J D 8]

In the rescue service's if you bend.break the rules and save someone you are a hero but if it all goes wrong and you fail then your an idiot ,or worse.

[Don Fry]

Posted by J D 8 on 15/06/2017 14:33:53:

In the rescue service's if you bend.break the rules and save someone you are a hero but if it all goes wrong and you fail then your an idiot ,or worse.

But such hero is regarded with some distrust by colleagues. Trust is shaken.

[Andy Palmer]

Sadly in this country, after years spent on various investigations and court proceedings, hundreds of eye witness reports, and many thousands of pages of paperwork, a committee will decide that someone made the wrong snap decision in the heat of the moment, and promptly crucify them

Edited By Andy Palmer on 15/06/2017 19:31:18

[Don Fry]

Very true, but what do his colleagues think.

[Josip Vrandecic -Mes]

I spent 30+ years in the Coast Guard and I learned that the individual is weak link but the a group of experts is even worse

[Don Fry]

Josip, that is a cynical and subtle remark.

[Josip Vrandecic -Mes]

Donald , possible, but a life shows us that.

Edited By Josip Vrandecic -Mes on 15/06/2017 20:45:29

Edited By Josip Vrandecic -Mes on 15/06/2017 20:45:49

[David Holland 2]

Josip, that is so true and in so many walks of life.

David

[J D 8]

+ 1 on the above.

[Phil Claridge]

i was in the same situation a few years ago in west sussex. we shared a flying sight with micro lights. the field started letting a flying ads cesssna 182 use the sight for take and landing in between assighnments. the pilot had returned from a job after refueling at shoreham. he reloaded all his gear and took off, he had to make a fairly tight left turn after take to avoid flying over a caravan site. i watched him take off from about 60 yards away, he made a clean take off but turned too tightly to soon and too low. the plane dropped its left wing and tipstalled and crashed in to a corn field. on its nose.there were only three people on the field, me and the man and his duaghter who rented the the site. both me and roger ran to the plane while the girl phoned 999 . she had gone with the pilot on the flight to shoreham.. the plane had come down in waist high very ripe dry corn. me and roger were running from diferent directions to the plane to see what we could do and praying it did not catch fire. when we got there i went to check on the pilot but sadly he had died on impact as we got our breath back we realised the starboard wing had partaily brocken off and petrol was pouring out, and the ignition was still on, so we decided that as we couldnt do anything for the pilot to get a good distance away in case it cuaght fire the fire brigade came but as the corn was so high and dry and petrol every where they decided to leave the pilot where he was covered the plane with a tarp and left it till the next morning to get him out.. me and roger never gave a thought about fire or anything else till we realiesed there was nothing we could do for the pilot