cymaz Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Posted by Peter Christy on 28/04/2019 09:23:54: Posted by Percy Verance on 28/04/2019 09:14:53: Speaking of which, there's an election in about a year or so I think....... Edited By Percy Verance on 28/04/2019 09:18:57 Exactly! Maybe even sooner - which is why I made the point of writing to my MP, who is very likely to lose her seat...! -- Pete As a side note, Mrs C and I have just received our polling cards for May 23 Euro elections......now where’s the bin? @ Martin H , I put that very point in the consultation @ Jon, agree with you Edited By cymaz on 28/04/2019 09:38:11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Laughton Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 As a side note, Mrs C and I have just received our polling cards for May 23 Euro elections......now where’s the bin? It's been spotted at 15,000 feet by a Sleazyjet captain Cymaz! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted April 28, 2019 Author Share Posted April 28, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GONZO Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 David Mellor "We like to consider ourselves distinct from, and better than the idiot drone flyers. The idiot drone flyers just ignore the rules and do as they please. Whilst we.....just ignore the rules and do as we please." False comparison. We can still fly safely and considerately, just not register and pay. Whereas 'the idiot drone flyers' do not fly safely and considerately. Not registering and paying does not automatically turn you into a dangerous and inconsiderate flyer. Likewise registering and paying does not make you a safe and considerate flyer. That there describes the futility of registration schemes to affect safety in any way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Posted by cymaz on 28/04/2019 09:34:07: As a side note, Mrs C and I have just received our polling cards for May 23 Euro elections......now where’s the bin? Whilst I understand the sentiment, not voting will just ensure the same idiots get elected again! Take the opportunity to send the powers-that-be a message, and vote for anyone except the main political parties. Even scrawling "none of these" across the ballot paper will send a more powerful message than simply not voting, *if enough people do it*! -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban8 Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Posted by Peter Christy on 28/04/2019 09:46:41: Posted by cymaz on 28/04/2019 09:34:07: As a side note, Mrs C and I have just received our polling cards for May 23 Euro elections......now where’s the bin? Whilst I understand the sentiment, not voting will just ensure the same idiots get elected again! Take the opportunity to send the powers-that-be a message, and vote for anyone except the main political parties. Even scrawling "none of these" across the ballot paper will send a more powerful message than simply not voting, *if enough people do it*! -- Pete Quite right. Our predecessors fought long and hard for ordinary people to have their political say - I will always go to the polling station to exercise my right to vote - whether I actually put a cross against a candidate is another matter and depends on how I feel at the time. I have sent a brief response to the CAA's registration consultation, outlining our usual objections etc etc. Whether it'll do any good is anyone's guess, as common sense, logic and the evidence of our excellent safety record going back decades, seems to cut no ice with the bureaucratic mind. This has been a perfect storm brewing up since the recreational drone craze first took hold. Edited By Cuban8 on 28/04/2019 10:11:58 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted April 28, 2019 Author Share Posted April 28, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Bastow Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 As I said yesterday this has little to do with safety but is a commercial decision, lead by the government wanting to be able to licence the airspace below 400 feet for commercial use. The drone frenzy is just the excuse they need. Much as I feel like not registering and paying I tend to agree with David that it would paint us all in a bad light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted April 28, 2019 Author Share Posted April 28, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted April 28, 2019 Author Share Posted April 28, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GONZO Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 As far as I am aware there is no legal requirement to have insurance for model flying and from the statistics not much of a risk to not have it. As bikes have been previously mentioned, there is no legal requirement to have insurance riding one of them. If you had ever been knocked flying by a reckless rider you would know they can be more dangerous than model planes due to the proximity of bikes to pedestrians. That's the point, in the vast majority of cases we do not operate our planes in areas of high people or structure density. Many of the model flyers I've meet on the beach near me have no insurance, belong to no club, do not belong to any national organisation and have no knowledge of any of them or what is being discussed here. When I was an active PPL, 20 yrs ago, there was no legal requirement to have insurance for GA flying and from discussions with the powered paraglider flyers who also use the beach it is still the same. Flying models in remote rural locations or on almost deserted beaches is so low risk it makes insurance irrelevant. In fact if the vast majority of BMFA claims are 'blue on blue' then flying at a club is indeed hazardous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Posted by David Mellor on 28/04/2019 10:21:02: If you want an example of how that plays out in the media, look at the first guy they arrested for the Gatwick drone-induced shut down. He was an innocent aeromodeller. For a short while the press had a feeding frenzy because it looked like they had caught the person responsible for stopping thousands of passengers from jetting off to their holidays or meeting up with friends and family. His name was leaked and plenty of people knew where he lived and wanted to give him grief (or harm, in some cases). All because of drone idiots. Let us not join them or be like them. Just a reminder of how vicious the 'holier-than-thou' press were in this case, here is the front page of the national publication concerned (I can't describe it as a newspaper.) Other reports the 'press' published shortly afterwards went out ot their way to show pictures of the couples house with the street name prominently displayed in the pictures. So let's not give the press any excuses to pull this sort of stunt again... I don't like the scheme the CAA have come up with. I responded to it on Friday evening with the arguments already mentioned, in particular describing their estimate of 170,000 people likely to register as laughable. I really don't know if our responses - and hopefully there will be a lot of responses - will make any difference, but the way forward in my view, is not to not register - that would just put us firmly in the position of being part of the "problem"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangster Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Ok I can concur with most of the responses here. Like others I cannot for the life of me believe that there is any scientific way of coming up with the 170,000, what will they do if it fall to say 100000? Up the figure to £28.00? 170000 does not seem a great number to maintain on a database, so why so expensive. Also they have compared to fishing licenses and firearm licenses, why? Anglers actually benefit from the work of the EA a gun license actually costs a lot to issue, checks, visit from the plod etc. We will see no benefit and will see nothing done for the cost. Now to play devils advocate and look on our own side. I as a long standing fixed wing modeller are frankly embarrassed by the them and us attitude , "idiots" "should be banned " etc. Come on guys yes sure we see this change as possibly that hammer that drives the nail into the coffin of our hobby and like you I guess I am as angry as many of you. But times change, I am willing to believe we are pretty much static in numbers, many other activities and sports have a 25% turn over, for reasons discussed on this very forum we do seem to be in the decline. Just look at the age profile shown on a surey on this forum.Yes this legislation will cause numbers to drop even more and faster. There have been those who opposed the BMFA including multi rotor aircraft flyers in their membership. We need the numbers, no they wont water things down too quickly, lets face it in spite of the majority flying RC for half a centurry the BFMA is still a free flight organisation. So multi rotor flying is popular and I daresay the majority who try it do so in a harmless way and either stick or move on, but a lot of people who do so have fun. So who are we, the minority to condem the majority. Having put the cat amongst the pigeons I leave you with this thought, tongue in cheek. What is more irresponsible. Flying a 2kg model that if control is lost sill set itself down gracefully. OR 3+kg of model that is totally out of control if the pilot or radio link fails,Failsafe? I dont think so. Agree or disagree but give it 5 seconds thought! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted April 28, 2019 Author Share Posted April 28, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Pretty much with Gangster, give over with the doomsday stuff, fill the consultation in and hope for the best. If all you've to whittle about is this, count yourself lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GONZO Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 In my case the cost is irrelevant, its the principle. If its a bad law then it should be opposed even to the extent of non compliance. I also know all about legal costs having expended to date almost £30,000 in legal fees in the last 3 .3 yrs against the builder of my house. It is an open and shut case but the legal system is not fit for purpose and allows those with money and influence to dance rings around it. Additionally, my avatar shows me hang gliding. You did not/do not(?) require insurance for that activity either. Yachting was another of my activities and no legal requirement for insurance either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Muir Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 I hesitate to join this discussion as it it strikes me as all just a wee bit overwrought, but here I go anyway. Firstly, all this 'end of the world as we know it' ranting is misplaced on here is it not? The rules have already been established, no new rules are being suggested and, as I recall, the rules and exemptions recently announced were greeted with sighs of relief all around and much congratulatory praise of the BMFA. Business as usual was the phrase being bandied about. Nothing has changed. What we're talking about here is registration, nothing else. We knew it was coming and nobody was terribly worried about it, so what's new? Well it turns out we're actually going to have to do it and pay for it ourselves. To which I say 'Big deal'. So we're going to have to give up half an hour of our time jumping through a few pointless on-line hoops which prove absolutely nothing. Could be worse. And we're going to have to pay a fee. Anybody who flies model aircraft of any sort can afford an extra £16.50 a year. Not the end of the world. Having said that, £16.50 is far too much. A lot of casual drone users won't want to shell out that much just for the odd flight a couple of times a year and it will hold back the numbers registering, and the CAA's funding model will fail. I can't blame the CAA though. They've been told to get it done and make it pay for itself. Unless our government decides to subsidise the system, like every other government has done, which seems unlikely, we're stuck with it. We shouldn't be surprised, everything costs more in the UK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul C. Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 I have completed the consultation but do not really expect anything to come of it. At the end of the day if it becomes a legal requirement then I will pay up and register there is no way that I am going to leave myself open to any form of prosecution, if that's the price I have to pay to continue my hobby then so be it. In real terms it's 4 pints of beer, one servo, half gallon of fuel, the list goes on! When this comes into force some poor soul is going to be made an example off and I intend to make sure it is not me. There are times when you have little alternative than to just suck it up and get on with it, unfortunately I think that this is one of those times 😩 Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Dance 1 Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Here's a conundrum. You are a member of a model flying club, you have taken and passed your 'A' achievement test within the last two years, since the first revision of the compulsory questions. You apply for CAA registration which before it can be successfully completed involves an online test. You fail this test, now what happens? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Fraser Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Talking of competency tests - how would you rate Westminster's performance these last 3 years? Perhaps we'll have a chance soon to give them their grades. Marty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Why would you fail the test ? All the info is there to help us pass, we should all be current with the latest laws and the bumf, been in the news a fair bit about Examiners being up to snuff, should it be any different for others ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted April 28, 2019 Author Share Posted April 28, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Marsh Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 I'm not bothering doing the CAA thingy - waste of time, time better spent emptying the cat litter tray out! Probably the next thing is Electric flight being Euro 6 compliant.... Engines banned and low powered electric flight only and models less than 10 DB noise limit, i.e. stay on the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Lomax Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 One point that I made in my response was "Thirdly, it will only penalise the law abiding model fliers and drone operators. In the same way that people who use firearms to commit crime are unlikely to have a gun license, anybody planning to use a drone to disrupt airport operations or drop contraband into prisons will not register under this scheme." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GONZO Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 I liked the MAIL front page posted by John. So, lots on here are not only volunteering to go on a suspects list but pay for it so that they can feature on the front page when the next scare occurs. Simpsons got things to say **LINK** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.