Ron Gray Posted May 28, 2019 Author Share Posted May 28, 2019 @Alan - I use the R9M module in the external bay of the Horus and both this and the internal module seem to be fine running together. I've only done garden testing with it at the moment but will do a full range check plus failure checking when I'm up at the field on Friday. I've looked on line to see if there are any potential problems but haven't found anything, so I'm going to give it a go. @Andy - thanks. I still intend flying my electric powered 'planes with the X series RXs, including my 2m F3a, fingers crossed but I work on the basis that if I haven't had a problem over the past 4 years with maybe 30 different 'planes then..................... @Peter - thanks for all your help and I'm disappointed that the capacitor approach didn't produce a solution. Like you I do believe that it's a problem with the components but I do still need to test one last thing, that is to instal an old version of the firmware, if I can get one that is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Skilbeck Posted May 28, 2019 Share Posted May 28, 2019 Can you test the 2.4 ghz and 858 mhz independently? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted May 28, 2019 Author Share Posted May 28, 2019 Yes, simply unplug one from the RB10 or switch off on the TX. I plan to leave the TX with a mate then take the ‘plane in my van, 1 mile away then check if it’s receiving. Edited By Ron Gray on 28/05/2019 22:37:46 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Hilton Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 Thanks Ron I have a couple of models I would like dual frequency safety on so watching with interest Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert mcleod Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 Found this thread rather late from a clubmate (thanks Alan) I lost a model late last summer running a X8R and Rcxcel ignition unit, failure/crash was a mystery until now! I experienced the odd very fast fail safe hold on the odd occasion, so fast i wasn,t sure it even happened. Tested everything and found no problem, just re routed the aerials (not the board type antenna) and range tested, all good. The final incident was during a touch and go when the model violently rolled from 6ft or so the wing tip striking the ground. Worst senario, was it me? Checked model over all was working, the only clue was the bent aileron linkage showed full deflection when it struck the ground. Nothing worse than suspecting radio link failure. I decided to replace the Rx and noticed the X8R Pro on T9 site! Alarm bells rang. Model repaired with new Rx and no more problems. I never had the telemetry lost warning on the previous Rx. I have since replaced my other Rx,s to the Pro on other petrol models, lucky not to loose those too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert mcleod Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 Found this thread rather late from a clubmate (thanks Alan) I lost a model late last summer running a X8R and Rcxcel ignition unit, failure/crash was a mystery until now! I experienced the odd very fast fail safe hold on the odd occasion, so fast i wasn,t sure it even happened. Tested everything and found no problem, just re routed the aerials (not the board type antenna) and range tested, all good. The final incident was during a touch and go when the model violently rolled from 6ft or so the wing tip striking the ground. Worst senario, was it me? Checked model over all was working, the only clue was the bent aileron linkage showed full deflection when it struck the ground. Nothing worse than suspecting radio link failure. I decided to replace the Rx and noticed the X8R Pro on T9 site! Alarm bells rang. Model repaired with new Rx and no more problems. I never had the telemetry lost warning on the previous Rx. I have since replaced my other Rx,s to the Pro on other petrol models, lucky not to loose those too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerOC Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 I have had a similar experience recently. I have a model with an RB10 redundancy system and 2 X8R's. Separate batteries for RX's and ignition. The model is powered with a DLE 30 and standard ignition. I having been flying it for 6 months without issue. I had a mishap on take off and put it in nose first breaking the prop. After a going through all the checks and replacing the prop I took it out to the field, started the engine and it immediately started going rapidly in and out of fail safe mode. The conclusion was that the either the cdi or the ignition lead had been damaged. Have now replaced the ignition system with a HK ignition system and the engine starts better and runs better than with the original system and we have had no further issues with interference. Conclusion there must have been stray spark issues causing the problems. Never experienced total lockout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 Let's hope it wasn't just a loosened plug cap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 10, 2019 Author Share Posted June 10, 2019 @TOC - my advice would be to swap both X8Rs for the R Pro RXs, or, like me go for the R9 module. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerOC Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 Posted by Martin Harris on 10/06/2019 22:33:41: Let's hope it wasn't just a loosened plug cap! ??????? With respect some of us do have brains. I did say I did some extensive testing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 Obviously not the case then and I wasn't inferring any lack of competence on your part - I thought you were talking about airframe checks - but some plug caps can give the impression they are connected while leaving a spark gap, sometimes to the detriment of the ignition system which can suffer permanent damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerOC Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 Posted by Martin Harris on 11/06/2019 17:53:21: Obviously not the case then and I wasn't inferring any lack of competence on your part - I thought you were talking about airframe checks - but some plug caps can give the impression they are connected while leaving a spark gap, sometimes to the detriment of the ignition system which can suffer permanent damage. The cdi units used on the DLE have a split ring on the spark plug cap that expands over the plug hexagonal section when fitted correctly. If fitted incorrectly it falls off. They are known to be a pain to lever off when on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 12, 2019 Author Share Posted June 12, 2019 It’s not just the cap to plug fitting, as that can be easily seen on a CM6 type plug, it’s the HT inner wire / resistor / cap connections inside the cap that can form a gap and cause arching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flight1 Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 hi is it only the x8r that has an issue with spark ignition ? has this issue been seen on other rx's like the x6r, r-xsr or even the RX8R , why i'm asking is I have a large dh82a 33% on a rx8r and a redundency xm+ connected which I have flown a few times with no issues, so this has got me questioning my set up? Edited By flight1 on 13/06/2019 15:21:46 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Rodi Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 Good afternoon everyone, I had the same problem, one year later, using x8r and l9r receivers. They seem to be the only ones subject to the problem, that manifests itself without continuity. Marco. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen kempenaers Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 Posted by flight1 on 13/06/2019 14:59:18: hi is it only the x8r that has an issue with spark ignition ? has this issue been seen on other rx's like the x6r, r-xsr or even the RX8R , why i'm asking is I have a large dh82a 33% on a rx8r and a redundency xm+ connected which I have flown a few times with no issues, so this has got me questioning my set up? Edited By flight1 on 13/06/2019 15:21:46 I tested it yesterday, it is on the RX8R as well. I first noticed a hesitation in my trottle, when testing my plane on the ground. Didn't think about it too much, replaced the old servo. Issues didn't disappear. Engine in place was a DLE55. Then I replaced the receiver X8R with and RX8R, same issue ... with the PRO my issue is gone. Also something to notice, on my other plane I have an RCGF35 engine with a X8R, no issues at all, flew it already like 50 times, far away, close, no interruptions. Then I have a plane with and old Husqvarna chainsaw engine, with magneto ignition, plain X8R, no issues at all, this one doesn't even have a metal shielding around the plug, nor does it have metal shielding around the spark plug cable ... the worst setup you could image when it comes to RF interference Then on another setup I have a DLE55, RX8R in place with an XM+ in redundant mode. This one doesn't have the issue. But I must still check it, maybe the RX8R goes into lockout and the XM+ takes over? I'm puzzled with it!! Also I can't believe they didn't test it themselves at Frsky, I have a random setup and I have issues, I came from Spektrum, tested the X8R in several foamies before I went to gas, my first gassers, no issues ( the RCGF35 and the Husqvarna now I want to move on, and I get these issues .... It scares me, because what's next? Will they test their next batch of receivers? Or do they leave it up to us?? Crashing out planes and emailing them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen kempenaers Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 Some more testing results ... With the RX8R in place, and my engine revving from idle to WOT I can really induce the lock out. Every time, time and time again, first some failsafes then completely locked out until I repower the receiver. Now I did something interesting: When I fully locked out the RX8R, led went red, no more control possible, engine keeps running, I put in an XM+ into the Rx in port of the RX8R, this XM+ was also bound to the model in place. Guess what, the red led went off and I got back in to control .... then with the XM+ in place, connected to the RX8R I could start revving up and down, I could no longer induce the lock out, then I removed the XM+, 6 seconds and bam, complete lock out .... Interesting also is that while the XM+ is in place the RX8R doesn't get the red led anymore ... and then I ran out of gass Edited By stephen kempenaers on 13/03/2020 12:58:49 Edited By stephen kempenaers on 13/03/2020 12:59:31 Edited By stephen kempenaers on 13/03/2020 13:01:45 Edited By stephen kempenaers on 13/03/2020 13:02:26 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy J Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 Stephen out of interest what software are you using on your Tx when seeing these lock outs? If using FRSKY SW have you updated to the latest version yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Marsh Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 Interesting. Still, that should never happen. As I mentioned, have 4 of these, and won't be using them in any models, no thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted April 21, 2020 Author Share Posted April 21, 2020 Bottom line is, as I mentioned in posts above, to be safe, with CDI units only use the PRO versions or the R9 versions. T9's website says this: , (Please note if using ignition systems use RX8R Pro) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen kempenaers Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 I tested it with the latest two receiver firmware versions ( the latest two that support ACCST, the onces just before ACCESS was added ) So to be more precise, the one just before FrSky added the "fix" for the lockout and the one that should have the fix for the lockout, makes no different. They went into lockout just the same. Bottomline to me is, never use the X series again, the receiver shouldn't go into the locked state. Today my CDI is the source of the distortion, but tomorrow the source can be something else. So when flying a X8R in an electrical plane, and having some other source of distortion, it will most likely make that plane crash. This should never be the behaviour. and the funny thing is, as I described above, when the receiver locks out, and I plug in a XM+ as redundant receiver ( one that I bound before to the model off course ) the lock is released and the plane can be controlled again. I really hated this one, because I really loved OpenTX and my Taranis, but I went to Futaba FASST, given up a lot of features, paying a lot more money, but in the end, what is the use of features if your plane crashes and maybe hurting other people, especially when going into lock like mine did, quite scary when a big gas plane locks up when you're at full throttle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 As far as i can make out, the issue is peculiar to models using CDI ignition systems. I've been using X series receivers in a variety of models (electric and glow) pretty much since they came out, and not had a single issue. I only have one CDI equipped model, fairly old now, and that is still flying on DSM-2 - because its what I had at the time I acquired it! (If it ain't broke, don't fix it!) Whilst I understand the angst of those who have had issues with CDI equipped models, the issue doesn't seem to affect other methods of propulsion. I will happily carry on flying my models using X (and D!) series receivers as the benefits far outweigh the disadvantages which, so far, haven't affected me. -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Walby Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 Stephen, IMHO the right decision. I don't know where you would stand from a legal position if you knowingly continued to operate a model with the knowledge that the RX could lock up. If you had a serious accident the insurer may take the view that you were partly or wholly responsible. The view is normally as far as reasonably practicable and saying it passed it range check and fail safe, but you knew that there was a known issue would be a very uncomfortable justification in my book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Marsh Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 The question is (also ANo order): if unsure if safe flight to go ahead then it should not do so. I will not use those rx, and will put them in the bin now. I'm not risking it, thinking it's ok, even on an electric model, and it goes in, worse, it hits someone. No thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 It's disturbing as I had 3 X8Rs in use in petrol models a couple of years ago with not one glitch. That was when the receivers had the big fat paddles fitted, and I've used them in electric models for several years, again with no problems. Stephen, what is the big voltage regulator next to the receiver and under one aerial? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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