Just like the look

[tiny-james]

So today I was looking on my facebook RC group when a RC plane came to my attention a nice plane that looks tobe a trainer I like the clean lines of the plane 

 

I managed to trace the type of model. I beleive  It was a Cirrus RC Plane I was just wondering if it's available in a Balsa Kit I could start to Build for electric motor

 

 

[Don Fry]

It’s an e-flite Cirrus from Horizon Hobby. Not a trainer, perhaps a 4th aircraft in line  as it’s aerobatic, pretty wide flight envelope. 

[tiny-james]

Thank you Don I'll keep looking would you recommend a BALSA kit to make electric please 

 

[David Davis 2]

Tiny-James, it's not that difficult to convert a model originally designed for an i/c engine to electric power. I've done this with a DB Sport & Scale "Sky Rider" plan pack. Build blog here: https://forums.modelflying.co.uk/index.php?/topic/50509-the-cost-of-building-recording-the-financial-cost-of-building-a-db-sport-scale-skyrider-a-surprise-for-miss-blue-eyes/#comments

 

With this plan pack you get the wing ribs, the patterns and the main undercarriage but you have to buy all the balsa sheet and  strip wood yourself. I built mine for a total cost of £160. It flies very well on a 3S LiPo and would make an excellent second or third model.

 

Mine stalls viciously but that's my fault for not aligning the wings correctly, it's not a fault of the design and I am an experienced enough pilot to be able to handle it. I'm going to try a few alterations suggested by people on this forum to see whether I can improve matters.

 

 

[kc]

There are not too many balsa trainers for electric made now.  You should look at the Shindig made by Phoenix Model Products - fairly good size at 51 inches.   

Ben Buckle has a Super 60 kit and some vintage models which could be electric.  Super 60 is larger and therefore easy to see and fly.    The plan is available free on Outerzone and you could buy laser cut wing ribs etc from iGull.

[Don Fry]

I’d perhaps have a look at a David Boddington Excellence. Plan available from Sarik. Might be available for free on Outerzone. 4Max gives electric conversion suggestions, and they know their trade. I don’t know the precise origin of the plane, it might be a magazine plan. Others might know.
As easy as a plane goes together,  and I would build it from scratch, cut your own wood. Then when you break it, the unbroken bits can go to a replacement, keeps the costs down. 
Look at the sexy, the beautiful, when you can fly cheap and cheerful stuff with a bit of confidence. Believe or not, you get more kudos at a club with a handmade airframe that’s basic, that some foam masterpiece from the Far East.

[kevin b]

Plus 1 for the excellence as a follow on trainer.

I have the RCM&E plan and article.

Just message me if you want a copy TJ.

[David Davis]

Tiny James, I'm assuming that you want to build a model while you learn to fly on your foam ARTFs. Another DB Sport & Scale plan pack which would suit as a second or third model is the Barnstormer 63. This is quite an elegant parasol wing design which may be finished as a three or four channel model: https://www.dbsportandscale.com/barnstormer-63-7739-p.asp

 

I would also endorse kc's suggstion of a Ben Buckle Super 60 kit. Like the Barnstormer it may be finished as either a three or a four channel model with ailerons. https://www.benbucklevintage.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_4&products_id=11  

 

 If you've never built a model before, now that you are a member of a club, you should find someone to help you with the build

 

                                                 

[Graham Davies 3]

3 hours ago, Don Fry said:

I’d perhaps have a look at a David Boddington Excellence. Plan available from Sarik. Might be available for free on Outerzone. 4Max gives electric conversion suggestions, and they know their trade. I don’t know the precise origin of the plane, it might be a magazine plan. Others might know.
As easy as a plane goes together,  and I would build it from scratch, cut your own wood. Then when you break it, the unbroken bits can go to a replacement, keeps the costs down. 
Look at the sexy, the beautiful, when you can fly cheap and cheerful stuff with a bit of confidence. Believe or not, you get more kudos at a club with a handmade airframe that’s basic, that some foam masterpiece from the Far East.

Massive fan of this model. Back in the day, there were loads in our club. And there was a accidental bonus discovery; built as plan it is a very pleasant, predictable model. Built with a gangster 52 wing cut down to 48 at the root, it was fully aerobatic, and brilliant fun! Either which were easy to make.

[EarlyBird]

RM299 Excellence - Sarik Hobbies - for the Model Builder

Edited December 12, 2022 by EarlyBird

[kc]

I think the Super 60 or the Barnstormer 63 would make a much better trainer than the Excellence ( too small) or the Skyrider ( designed to be a 2nd or 3rd model )

 

Barnstormer is more dificult to build than the Super 60 due to the struts needing careful alignment,  Both are classics that have stood the test of time.    Both fly beautifully as electric models but try to build them as light as possible.

[tiny-james]

Wow so many planes to choose from also it’s always humbles me at the response’s given freely

So back to the kit. I don’t own a fret saw So I would need to go down the avenue of laser cut material. I quite like the look of the barnstormer 63.

I will be using electric motor (not interested in IC) 

 

where do I start do I just order a kit. Also will the kit include hardware like linkage, hindges and servo's ? 

[David Davis 2]

Tiny-James, the Barnstormer 63 is a plan pack or short kit. If you have a look at the description it tells you exactly what you will get. You will need to buy extra sheet and strip wood to complete the model. Few of the builders' kits even the full kits like the Super 60 supply linkages horns and servos so these will all have to be bought separately. https://www.dbsportandscale.com/barnstormer-63-7739-p.asp

 

My Sky Rider, a similar size model to the Barnstormer, cost £160 to build but to get it into the air I needed an electric motor, a couple of LiPos, a speed controller, several servos, a propeller and a radio of course.

 

You probably won't need a fret saw to build the model, a scalpel will be fine for most of the work but hand held fret saws are not expensive anyway.

[Caveman]

Hi James, I think you need to clarify exactly what you're looking for. As I understand it you've already got a Phoenix 1600 glider and a Max Thrust Riot, both ideal planes for learning to fly.

 

Are you then looking for a low wing plane, like the Cirrus, to build and progress to, but not fly until you're competent?

 

A balsa plane will be heavier than a foam model and will require a bit more care when landing etc.

 

Perhaps something like this would be suitable as a first step towards a balsa plane Galaxy Models Fiesta 4 (pegasusmodels.co.uk). Look at the user reviews for this model.....

 

Pegasus also have low wing kits, on the Pegasus home page search for Galaxy to see all their kits. The kits are comprehensive, including all the parts needed, and if you're going electric, some you won't need like the fuel tank and motor mount.

 

Whatever balsa plane/kit you buy you'll need to invest in some basic hand tools for cutting and sanding balsa, plywood and plastics, plus some glues and a covering iron and iron-on covering. You'll need other bits and pieces but they can be bought as needed.

 

GDB

Edited December 12, 2022 by Caveman
Additional text

[tiny-james]

@Caveman Yes you are right I'm after my third plane for when I'm ready and confident to fly the next stage of my learning curve as you have suggested a plane I can build (balsa).

 

I have looked at some of the builds on the forum as there are quite a few that have taken anywhere from 6 months to 5 years to build.

I do have some hand tools plus a home made cnc machine, a wood lathe, a big band saw, router both ¼ and ½ inch and a nice bench saw. I have a Dremel as well so hand tool my hand tools are well stocked, but I don’t own an electric fretsaw I do own an electric bench sander. Wood glue, CA glue and a small laser engraver that would cut thin balsa and card (ortho) I have soldering iron, hot air gun and a glue gun. I have a compresser and spray gun small (300ml header) and a air brush or two

 

So yes I'm after a plane like the Cirrus I can build and when I'm ready to fly it 

 

CNC has a cutting area for 1200x800cm quite big for home made and the laser is two foot square I think I also have a Jig saw (hand held)

Edited December 13, 2022 by tiny-james

[Don Fry]

Well set up for tools then. I have a fret saw, but a mate has always used his jig saw , mounted on a board with the blade sticking up. I rarely use the fretsaw, and when I did usually finish stuff off on the sanding machine. Keep an eye out for a biggish second hand drill press. But I alway think, with a bandsaw is king in the workshop. This week, it cut from a piece of straight grain pine, the six 2 meter spars for big Ugli Stik. Little cost, and the wing is stronger if there are no joins in the spars.

[Caveman]

Hi James, no shortage of tools and skill then! There’s no need for a powered fretsaw, a hand one is quite adequate.

Have a browse on outerzone.co.uk, there’s plenty of plans to look at but you would have to cut your own pieces. Alternatively Google rc plane kits and see if you can find anything you fancy.

 

GDB

 

[GrumpyGnome]

Personally, I'd start with a kit first - if you can find one you like. Probably more chance of success as, generally, you'll get half-decenf instructions and need to interpret less for yourself.... then do something from a plan.....

[tiny-james]

Don I also have a pillar drill right then just a kit to buy.

 

thanks for all the suggestion everyone 

[David Davis]

James, I have been flying r/c models since 1988 and I built my first model aeroplane, a rubber powered free flight job  in 1959 when I was eleven years old. I am neither a particularly good pilot nor builder but I have built quite a few models and they have all flown despite some of them being less than perfectly built including my latest! However, for the last twenty-five years I have taught several retired beginners how to fly r/c and my take on the current situation is as follows.

 

Most beginners start with electric powered foamy models. These have very low wing loadings which means that they fly very slowly and are easy to land. When a beginner moves on to a balsa and ply model aircraft they find that they fly more quickly. Some beginners need time to adjust to the difference and damage their models in the process. Consequently, in my opinion, your first balsa model needs to be tough above everything else. If you were to chose an ARTF trainer I'd unreservedly recommend a Seagull Boomerang, the 61" version. These come with all of the parts for either an i/c engine or an electric motor and there's less emotional attachment to an ARTF compared with something you've built yourself.  They cost about £150 which is about the same price which you would pay for a comparable kit but you wouldn't have to pay for the glue or covering material..

 

If you're set on building a model from a kit, my advice is that you start with a trainer. There will be something of a learning curve from flying foamies to flying a balsa model as I've already said. My recommendation would be the Ben Buckle Super 60. It's tough, it can fly pretty slowly and it's available as a full kit. https://www.benbucklevintage.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_4 I've built two of them, one from a plan, the other from a kit and I bought another one ready built. From what I can remember the kit came with all of the hinges, horns and other accesories. You could start with the three channel version which is very stable then build an aileron wing for it or you could start with the four channel version if you are confident flying with ailerons. It will need converting to electric power but that's what I did with my last one.

 

Once you are able to take off, fly around and land your four channel trainer repeatedly without damaging it, it's time to move on to a low wing trainer. Only then would I advise building the Cirrus.

 

That means that the Cirrus is five models down the road from where you are now. I don't wish to rain on your parade but I've seen too many short cuts end in tears.

 

Just my two pennorth.

 

[kc]

If you already have a bandsaw then a hand fretsaw will be handy for the fancy cut out parts.  But better than a fretsaw is a 'Piercing saw '  also called a 'jewellers saw'  ( about £6 at Axminster Power Tools ) which is just a fretsaw with a small frame which is easier to use.   Uses fretsaw blades.

A Coping saw will do but the blades are coarser.  ( blades should be inserted as a fretsaw - to cut on the pull stroke.  Not a lot of people know that! )

 

A jigsaw mounted as described by Don with the blade sticking up is surely too dangerous to use!  

[Caveman]

James, have a look here. There's high wing trainers and low wing models - Electric Models (phoenixmp.com)

 

You can download and read the instructions to see what you're letting yourself in for! I think David's advice ref. the Seagull Boomerang is good. It's the sort of model you can fly to death and become thoroughly familiar and competent with.

 

GDB

[Frank Skilbeck]

Clubmate built the Astro Jr from Century UK, would be a nice 1st build and fine 3rd model. I

 

 

[gangster]

Sounds like you have a great set of tools for modelling. I shiould not be too concerned not having an electric f etsaw you will do most things with the bandsaw and the sander. Have you thought about some of the RCME free plans look at the Peter Miller or Lindsey Todd designs. Fantastic models and if you do wish you can get the ribs laser cut from Sarik. Your choice if you get the pack or cut your own  If you are not sure compare the cost!  Lots of good designs to go for. Have a look at the Dawn Flyer. Hound Dog or Ohmen. Lots of othe good ones too. Don’t forget that there will be build threads on this very forum, together with lots of fellow modellers on here that have actuallly built them. If you choose a design put the name into the search function on here or even Google. If there are any amendments, plan errors or mods they will be on here

[tiny-james]

@DavidDavis 2 Thank you for your advice I'm going for the Seagull Boomerang 61 but what is the difference between a High wing and a low wing. I know that they are mounted High and low but what is the difference in flight?