leccyflyer Posted January 23 Share Posted January 23 33 minutes ago, Arthur Harris said: Not at all, and I am sure most people realise that. I have no power or wish to throw anyone under a bus. I was merely making the point that a noisy minority could cause problems for the majority. This I think is a good analogy: imagine a council tells a house full of noisy students: "there's complaints about the noise, if you don't keep it down, you will all be evicted". Most students want to stay in the house, and listen to music comparatively quietly, but a small group says, "it's our fundamental right to listen to loud rock music at 2am if we want to, we should all stand together and challenge the council!" And then they all get evicted. It's not a bad analogy is it, and a reasonable argument? I think it's a terrible analogy TBH and does not reflect the position that had been adopted - and is continued in this thread. A better analogy might be the one student who says that they don't like listening to music, other than with headphones on and asks the council to just ban the playing of all music, other than Cliff Richards played at modest volume through modest headphones, no speakers, which the council are more than happy to oblige. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Harris Posted January 23 Share Posted January 23 31 minutes ago, leccyflyer said: I think it's a terrible analogy TBH and does not reflect the position that had been adopted - and is continued in this thread. A better analogy might be the one student who says that they don't like listening to music, other than with headphones on and asks the council to just ban the playing of all music, other than Cliff Richards played at modest volume through modest headphones, no speakers, which the council are more than happy to oblige. No, it's the CAA. Hardly anyone wants the end of ICE cars, yet it will all end in 2030 or 2035. The same with ICE model planes- why would car drivers appreciate being forced to drive electric cars and see modellers still flying ICE planes? It would drive me mad to have to buy a £30k electric car to drive to a flying field where modellers were still allowed to fly ICE planes! If you think about it, you would agree. I'm actually on your side, I'm just being a realist! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fry Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 Arthur, you say “Hardly anyone wants the end of ICE cars, yet it will all end in 2030 or 2035.” Might I ask the source of that statement. I’ve just had a wade through the internet and can’t find much support for it. It seems younger drivers don’t, and a German study refutes it. I have no hat in that argument, but I like statistics to be bearers of truth rather than prevarication's to deceive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 (edited) It's just another of Arthur's sweeping statements fuelled by a belief that he is entirely in tune with the majority of people on the planet. Edited January 24 by GrumpyGnome 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 6 hours ago, Arthur Harris said: It would drive me mad to have to buy a £30k electric car to drive to a flying field where modellers were still allowed to fly ICE planes! If you think about it, you would agree. I'm actually on your side, I'm just being a realist! If you lived near me, you'd be accompanied by the sound of ic-powered chain saws, lawnmowers, leaf blowers, strimmers, and farm machinery. Also passing a number of workshops heated by diesel. And a number of houses with uc generators because the occupants have health issues that would become critical in a power cut like the 19 hour one we experienced a few days ago. 'If you think about it', ic powered planes are a tiny tiny portion of the fosssil fuel users. And by wanting to ban certain aspects of the hobby, you're most certainly not on 'my side'. P.S. nobody will force you to buy a £30k electric car. From a certain point all NEW cars will be electric - there will still be millions of ic powered cars on the roads. And lots for sale..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leccyflyer Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 9 hours ago, Arthur Harris said: No, it's the CAA. Hardly anyone wants the end of ICE cars, yet it will all end in 2030 or 2035. The same with ICE model planes- why would car drivers appreciate being forced to drive electric cars and see modellers still flying ICE planes? It would drive me mad to have to buy a £30k electric car to drive to a flying field where modellers were still allowed to fly ICE planes! If you think about it, you would agree. I'm actually on your side, I'm just being a realist! I've thought about it and certainly don't agree. 2035 is just a decade away and it is inconceivable that you'll be forced to buy an electric car for £30,000 or that all of the vehicles powered by internal combustion engines will be gone. Highly unlikely that aeroplanes powered by internal combustion engines will have all gone as well and it would be a very sad state of affairs if that highly unlikely scenario came to pass in such a short period of time. Hopefully we'll still be able to hear the crackle of a Merlin engine and see the splendour of the hundredth anniversary flight of a Spitfire. None of which has anything to do with the topic under discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 Lots of things on this thread are waaayyyyyy off topic.... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john davidson 1 Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 (edited) No one has mentioned football fields, plenty about and usually deserted, think that would be my definition of a PARK Mention of method of home heating pricked my ears up, although well off topic, a friends landlord has obtained a huge grant to convert all their cottages to air source heat pump. He is spending around £20 a day on electric , probably more than if pure electric heated. Edited January 25 by john davidson 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toto Posted January 25 Author Share Posted January 25 I'd agree John ( pending bye laws etc ) but what size / type of model do you think would be sensible for such a space ..... if flying were permitted. Toto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Bradly Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 I spent several years thrashing the pants off a Precision Aerobatics Addiction, and a few GWS foamies at sports fields. Made me a much better overall flier. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Bowers Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 19 minutes ago, toto said: I'd agree John ( pending bye laws etc ) but what size / type of model do you think would be sensible for such a space ..... if flying were permitted. Toto That's an impossible question, as too many other factors, many of which have been listed in this thread. As you've correctly stated, it's all down to assessing and managing risk. However how much risk is tolerable and how is it assessed? For models over 250g the rule is 30m. OK, reduced to 15m if a specific risk assessment and mitigations are in place - but do we really want to go there - I certainly don't. Key is to have complete control of the model and adequate separation from other users. I have a small park nearby, a couple of hundred metres away. Village hall grounds. 60m by 60m. I'll sneak a few flights in with a 50g guarded prop quad there, nothing bigger. I probably don't fly further than 15m away. If anybody else enters the space I pull in very close, within 5m, and usually land. The "anybody else" is normally accompanied by a child, a dog or both. A larger country park is about 600m by 600m. When it's quiet, I'll fly a 1 m wingspan sub 1 Kg foamy, but way away from anybody else, and within 50m of myself. Sometimes a 500mm Nutball. When it's not quiet, I'll not fly there. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toto Posted January 25 Author Share Posted January 25 I think the idea in principle is fine but given the easy access to the general public and the theoretical footprint of a football field, the type of model I would use would be along the lines if the models I posted up earlier in this thread. I respect that opinions will differ though and I'm fine with that as well. Toto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 "Can I make this flight safely" has long been the case, and models larger than a Riot have been flown many a time, and rightly so. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Griff Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 Apparently football pitches come in different sizes ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toto Posted January 25 Author Share Posted January 25 Erm ....... regulation size ..... Hmmmm ..... which regulations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Harris Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 2 hours ago, john stones 1 - Moderator said: "Can I make this flight safely" has long been the case, and models larger than a Riot have been flown many a time, and rightly so. My worry would be a mechanical failure, which is probably more frequent than radio failure now radios are so reliable. Safety is the main aspect as you say, and no one, imo, should fly in a public place unless they are confident of their ability as a pilot. As @john davidson 1 and @Dale Bradly say, sports fields are large areas that are often deserted. But, most people, including myself, prefer traditional built-up models with IC engines, and there is no way they can be flown in a park, so once we have joined a club, the question of park flying becomes moot anyway. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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