Club memberships.

[Brian Cooper]

Kids:

Can anybody think of any pastime/activity which does not embrace children taking part?

 

Children are encouraged to take part in everything from chess to sailing, karate, swimming, shooting, and every sport in-between. And the younger they start, the better they become at it by the time they have grown up.

 

Indeed, a child can fly a full sized glider solo at the age of 14, and many kids are learning to fly them at considerably younger ages.

 

But model flying...??? 

We just make excuses. 

[cymaz]

The AMA has a problem getting new members…interesting video

 

[GrumpyGnome]

It was interesting...... some of those things we already do at our club (BMFA Hosted web site, free juniors, tuition), still difficult to get younger members.

 

Interesting that they focus on web sites not Faceb*** - we seem to get much more traffic on FB...... and it's so much easier to load content

[cymaz]

4 minutes ago, GrumpyGnome said:

It was interesting...... some of those things we already do at our club (BMFA Hosted web site, free juniors, tuition), still difficult to get younger members.

 

Interesting that they focus on web sites not Faceb*** - we seem to get much more traffic on FB...... and it's so much easier to load content

Agree 100%

[Cuban8]

Not at all sure what to make of the video. Some good points, but just saying it's putting people off by having lots of boring rules and filling in forms isn't at all helpful. I loathe boring rules and filling in forms but in today's world that is so far away from what I recall as a young kid interested in modelling,  bureaucrats and those to be found all over the place wishing to make life difficult in order to justify their existance are gaining traction.

A fact of life whether you want to learn to drive or ride, take some rubbish to the dump or even become involved with model aircraft. If the need is there, people will grit their teeth and overcome - unfortunately, as we've said many times before, the idea of flight itself whether full size aviation or models has to a large extent become so common place, the 'magic' for want of a better term, is just not there as it once was - and with it, the craving to have one's very own flying machine albeit in small form.

[GrumpyGnome]

If you can just see a model plane in the air, turn up, watch closely, even have a go...... that's great.

 

If you see a model plane in the air, turn up, be told to go away and fill in lots of forms, then possibly have a go at some time in the future............ that's rubbish.

 

I totally agree with what they're saying.  It doesn't HAVE to be lots of regulation and form filling. Some clubs are their own worst enemies.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Disagree with much he says, simplistic assumptions implying X would've happened if Y had done more or earlier.

The hobby has had it's heyday, that's beyond dispute. Society has changed, people have much more choice.

Officious ? Don't buy that one either, do you really believe it's just modellers who have Rules/Laws to adhere to ?

 

So to having a trial flight ? Club trainer, 3 visit rule, covered by the clubs insurance, willing members looking to up membership by being open and friendly, who will take you till batterys run out. Will they tell you what the club/law requires if you join, of course they will. Those are facts not obstacles we or the BMFA/AMA dreamt up.

 

Club, 40 members, facebook club site 260 members, very active group, always pushing events, come have a go, been best recruiting tool we've ever had. Club once had 120 members 15-20 years ago.

 

Where are these new members we missed, where are they flying ?

[Cuban8]

58 minutes ago, GrumpyGnome said:

If you can just see a model plane in the air, turn up, watch closely, even have a go...... that's great.

 

If you see a model plane in the air, turn up, be told to go away and fill in lots of forms, then possibly have a go at some time in the future............ that's rubbish.

 

I totally agree with what they're saying.  It doesn't HAVE to be lots of regulation and form filling. Some clubs are their own worst enemies.

I manage the membership and BMFA admin for my club of 85 members. Unfortunately, there is a certain amount of form filling to be endured by new members, whether raw beginners or those transferring between clubs. Any paperwork that I process is neccessary for BMFA insurance, CAA registration etc and confidentiality. Naturally all of this is dealt with electronically via the BMFA Portal and even our club application form is able to be sent to me electronically. We have a small booklet of club rules that will take no more than a couple of minutes for even the slowest reader to go through and a single sheet of A4 in the form of a quick start guide that outlines the usual FAQs about using the field, security etc. All emailed now. We offer members the facility to have their membership, BMFA and CAA responsibilites dealt with by the club - pay your money and we sort it for you. Easy-peasy.....Simples etc. One or two members still prefer to deal with things themselves as 'country members' for some reason but that's OK with me. One old fashioned habit that was discussed as to whether we should scrap it was posting a real annual membership card to everyone - it costs a bit now in postage but members liked the idea of retaining it so we did.

I've no idea what other clubs get up to in terms of "regulations and form filling" but we work to the absolute minimum that's required to cover all bases - why would anyone want to complicate matters further and if anything, make the life of the club sec even more difficult and a drain on his time?

Edited August 25 by Cuban8

[payneib]

4 hours ago, GrumpyGnome said:

It was interesting...... some of those things we already do at our club (BMFA Hosted web site, free juniors, tuition), still difficult to get younger members.

 

I'm pretty much the only one who's benefited from that. I know you know, but for everyone else's benefit: I'm 38 (and 11/12s) with an 11yo and 5yo. The money I save from the kids club membership every year, keeps them on the books at the BMFA. I like them on the BMFA because they're now insured for the one in a million chances that the foamy chuck glider they're playing with at the field (or home) cracks a windscreen on another members (or neighbours) car. 

 

One thing I just don't know, is how to get my 11yo to fly. He goes on the buddy box, sometimes he's great, sometimes he starts whining. Consistency, mostly due to the rubbish summers we've had the last couple of years, is a major hindrance. But I think the biggest issue, is there's just no other kids. He'd rather sit in the car and play on a screen, because there's no other kids to "play toy aeroplanes" with. I think, the generational gaps aren't helping there: the "next youngest" members kids are slightly older, late teens and not interested. Then you're on to the "next youngest" members grandkids, being too young.

 

I'd really like to organise something with the young prodigy from FB (Flying Flynn), just for him to have another "toy aeroplane kid" to get him over that first hurdle, but we're not exactly local. 

 

I'm desperate to get him really going with it, but I'm completely out of ideas. 

 

4 hours ago, GrumpyGnome said:

Interesting that they focus on web sites not Faceb*** - we seem to get much more traffic on FB...... and it's so much easier to load content

I've got to say, as a club, our FB page(s) aren't great. Look at Vikings down the road - they're always on it. We need to open that right up, and spam it to death. 

[Cuban8]

5 minutes ago, payneib said:

 

 

 

 But I think the biggest issue, is there's just no other kids. He'd rather sit in the car and play on a screen, because there's no other kids to "play toy aeroplanes" with. I think, the generational gaps aren't helping there: the "next youngest" members kids are slightly older, late teens and not interested. Then you're on to the "next youngest" members grandkids, being too young.

 

 

Not an unusual situation at all - I've seen it with my own eyes at both of my clubs. Chaps bring their young kids over to watch and get a feel for what's going on and before you can say 'Minecraft' or 'Roblox' they're back in the car or laying on the grass facing away from the 'planes and 'gaming'.

Tried to get my own beloved grandson involved by starting with chuckies and Airfix but no go, so I don't push it any more.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

10 minutes ago, Cuban8 said:

I manage the membership and BMFA admin for my club of 85 members. Unfortunately, there is a certain amount of form filling to be endured by new members, whether raw beginners or those transferring between clubs. Any paperwork that I process is neccessary for BMFA insurance, CAA registration etc and confidentiality. Naturally all of this is dealt with electronically via the BMFA Portal and even our club application form is able to be sent to me electronically. We have a small booklet of club rules that will take no more than a couple of minutes for even the slowest reader to go through and a single sheet of A4 in the form of a quick start guide that outlines the usual FAQs about using the field, security etc. All emailed now. We offer members the facility to have their membership, BMFA and CAA responsibilites dealt with by the club - pay your money and we sort it for you. Easy-peasy.....Simples etc. One or two members still prefer to deal with things themselves as 'country members' for some reason but that's OK with me. One old fashioned habit that was discussed as to whether we should scrap it was posting a real annual membership card to everyone - it costs a bit now in postage but members liked the idea of retaining it so we did.

I've no idea what other clubs get up to in terms of "regulations and form filling" but we work to the absolute minimum that's required to cover all bases - why would anyone want to complicate matters further and if anything, make the life of the club sec even more difficult and a drain on his time?

 

Agree with C8. Modelflying has never been easier to get into, information on how/where has never been easier to find, the video makes claims that facts don't support, just lays blame and offers not much.

[Rich Griff]

GCSE or what ever they are called this year, a gcse in aeromodelling, and basic radio control........

 

A pipe dream, or is it ?

[John Tee]

My club, and I think of it as my club as I was one of the founding members in 1968 although I did have  a ten year break.  We have been very fortunate in bucking the trend,  in that we have reached our limit of 100 adults for the last ten years or more with a regular waiting list. We do lose a few most years. We are lucky enough to have a field we can use seven days a week for electric and gliders with i/c wednesdays and at weekends.The only draw back is in winter it is difficult to reach in very wet weather as it is the third field off the road and clay which causes access problems. we're are short of juniors only having four. Most are in the 50 plus age group. Our chairman is good at organising aa varied range of fun competitons and "special" day events so interest is alway there to try something different.

 

John

[payneib]

14 minutes ago, John Tee said:

 Our chairman is good at organising aa varied range of fun competitons and "special" day events so interest is alway there to try something different.

 

I tried that for a few years. 

 

Going to the effort of putting things together, buying some little prizes, advertising it, for literally two other guys to bother showing up was utterly demoralising.

 

There was a good turnout for the first BMFA "mass launch", but it didn't last for the second attempt, or for the "round the world" distance thing. 

 

The entire club was entirely uninterested. 

[Cuban8]

15 hours ago, Rich Griff said:

GCSE or what ever they are called this year, a gcse in aeromodelling, and basic radio control........

 

A pipe dream, or is it ?

An interesting notion. When I was at school and in my early teens, I was very interested in amateur astronomy (still am and own quite a nice reflecting telescope). Astronomy was offered as an O level subject and I still have a copy of Patrick Moore's 'Astronomy for O level' text book. I'd loved to have taken the exam but there was no way to do so at my state comprehensive school. Apologies, I digress.

More to the point is not so much Aeromodelling on the National Curriculum with exams, but the whole loss of practical subjects such as woodwork and metalwork that were around with large well equipped workshops in my school in the early 70s.

Can you imagine a fourteen year old being let loose on a lathe to do a simple turning job, or using a gas torch to discover how metal react to heating and being hardened etc today. Remember it well, and although my future lay more in the electronics side of engineering, that basic knowledge that was imparted by Mr Baben, out metal work teacher long ago is still invaluable to me today.

By the time that my daughter was at secondary school in the late 90s, something called 'Resistant Materials' had replaced the old subjects and didn't really teach kids much about engineering IIRC.

Times change and learning to run a lathe and milling machine as I did at college have, I suspect, been replaced with far more modern computer based subjects like programming, virtual design, 3D printing and CNC machines. So important that kids have the opportunity to become involved if they show an abilty or interest in the new engineering and design world. I'm not convinced that all do have that option.

That's all great, because the days of the 'old boy' turning out parts on his ancient Colchester lathe etc and running a small engineering business are rapidly disappearing along with the 'know how'.

The reasons for falling numbers of young folk interested in any practical 'hands on' hobby - and not just our particular one, are all connected.

 

[Cuban8]

16 hours ago, payneib said:

I tried that for a few years. 

 

Going to the effort of putting things together, buying some little prizes, advertising it, for literally two other guys to bother showing up was utterly demoralising.

 

There was a good turnout for the first BMFA "mass launch", but it didn't last for the second attempt, or for the "round the world" distance thing. 

 

The entire club was entirely uninterested. 

Same at both of my two clubs.

[payneib]

26 minutes ago, Cuban8 said:

Same at both of my two clubs.

It's a shame, because that first Mass Launch really got my kids excited for a day up the field, even the second one got them going. As many people as possible up the field, anyone not flying RC was press ganged in to service at the FF line (I bought a couple of packets of foam chuckees cheap off Amazon), the wife was on timing duties, a dozen fixed wing RC planes up at the same time was fairly exciting, and both boys wanted a go!

 

Come the second attempt, we had almost perfect weather and six guys showed up. It was basically a slightly busier flying day. 

[Cuban8]

Let's face it, the mass record attempt was a novelty event, something new and a chance to get your club in the news magazine. Great fun on the day - we managed to get a couple of dozen up together and no crashes. Not something that would get members going every year once the initial excitement and fun was over.

I'm sure we could think of something else that will get folks over the field again but it needs to be different. Not an easy ask.

[Brian Cooper]

I can't see the video. . It wants me to jump over too many "cookie hurdles". . I refused, so am unable to view it. 

 

Whenever I go flying, I usually take a trainer with me in case any youngsters turn up and show an interest. . It only takes a couple of minutes to get it ready. 

At least it gives them a taste of model flying, and they can always come back for more if they want to. 

 

However, it has to be said that our weather has been fairly unhelpful for the last couple of years.

When strong winds blow - and they do - beginners are not getting enough stick time. 

 

[MattyB]

20 hours ago, payneib said:

 

I'm pretty much the only one who's benefited from that. I know you know, but for everyone else's benefit: I'm 38 (and 11/12s) with an 11yo and 5yo. The money I save from the kids club membership every year, keeps them on the books at the BMFA. I like them on the BMFA because they're now insured for the one in a million chances that the foamy chuck glider they're playing with at the field (or home) cracks a windscreen on another members (or neighbours) car. 

 

One thing I just don't know, is how to get my 11yo to fly. He goes on the buddy box, sometimes he's great, sometimes he starts whining. Consistency, mostly due to the rubbish summers we've had the last couple of years, is a major hindrance. But I think the biggest issue, is there's just no other kids. He'd rather sit in the car and play on a screen, because there's no other kids to "play toy aeroplanes" with. I think, the generational gaps aren't helping there: the "next youngest" members kids are slightly older, late teens and not interested. Then you're on to the "next youngest" members grandkids, being too young.

 

I'd really like to organise something with the young prodigy from FB (Flying Flynn), just for him to have another "toy aeroplane kid" to get him over that first hurdle, but we're not exactly local. 

 

I'm desperate to get him really going with it, but I'm completely out of ideas. 

 

I've got to say, as a club, our FB page(s) aren't great. Look at Vikings down the road - they're always on it. We need to open that right up, and spam it to death. 

A important but probably unpopular  announcement - don’t imagine you will ever attract youngsters via Facebook. Facebook is seen as an old persons platform by the young - they all prefer Instagram. So don’t imagine you are on the cutting edge if you have a public facing Facebook page! And yes, I do have my very own teenager and an 10 year old so I am  absolutely confident of this. 

Edited August 26 by MattyB

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

We've attracted youngsters via FB, their parents use it. I'm not of the opinion there are many youngster to go get though.

[GrumpyGnome]

21 hours ago, payneib said:

I've got to say, as a club, our FB page(s) aren't great. Look at Vikings down the road - they're always on it. We need to open that right up, and spam it to death. 

 

There's no monopoly on it - if someone wants to be able to post, they just need to ask.   Nobody does.  Just the same as they don't supply pictures, or interesting articles for the web page......

 

Most of our club are irregular fliers at best.  They certainly won't be interested.  The hard core of 12 or so would be just posting pictures of the same planes over and over - if they were bothered.

 

Just had a peep at Vikings FB page - 330 members, 8 posts a month. Very little activity I can see.....

[GrumpyGnome]

22 hours ago, payneib said:

One thing I just don't know, is how to get my 11yo to fly. He goes on the buddy box, sometimes he's great, sometimes he starts whining. Consistency, mostly due to the rubbish summers we've had the last couple of years, is a major hindrance. But I think the biggest issue, is there's just no other kids. He'd rather sit in the car and play on a screen, because there's no other kids to "play toy aeroplanes" with. I think, the generational gaps aren't helping there: the "next youngest" members kids are slightly older, late teens and not interested. Then you're on to the "next youngest" members grandkids, being too young.

 

I'd really like to organise something with the young prodigy from FB (Flying Flynn), just for him to have another "toy aeroplane kid" to get him over that first hurdle, but we're not exactly local. 

 

Why not ask other local clubs if they have junior members - they can come to us, or go to them. They may have better ideas on Junior members than our aging club demographic 🙂  I'm sure our committee would be more than happy to support some sort of kids (and parents!) event.