Super Glue Allergy

[Capt Kremen]

After many bottles used and fingers stuck together over the years, now everytime I use Super Glue (any brand, or viscosity) I get 'flu/streaming running nose' like symptoms for days afterwards.

Is the oderless variety any better for not creating this bothersome condition?

[Oh and yes I do apply the glue in a well ventilated area, (often outside if weather permits), and try not to directly inhale the fumes etc. but it's not totally practical when sticking say two Multiplex Elapor foam fuselages together - other glues don't stck it very well and are not recommended in any case].

I do have and use the other varieties aliphatic, pva, epoxy etc. but some sticking requirements are still best done with good old cyano.

Any useful, practical advice welcomed.

[Steve W-O]

Yes, the odourless is better

[buffetslayer]

i started using CA recently as it really appealed to my impatient nature. however, i am gonna have to bin it and go back to good old PVA as i am finding even the slightest esxposure to it now leaves me wheazing, restricted breathing, streaming eyes and nose and reaching for the benedryl. the symptoms dont come on straight away but kick in hours later and are terrible. i spent a week of feeling roughthinking i had a cold so sitting building (using CA) and just getting worse 'til i remembered a thread like this. Funny thing is ive always been very un-allergic to things in the past. The mrs keeps trying to convince me that its the lager im allergic too but i wont have it lol. that said, i do think it may exasperate the symptoms. i think the only cure for me is to stop using it altogether.

Anybody tried this 'superphatic' glue? is it any better than PVA or work better for particular jobs?

Personally i think itll be PVA for me from now and trying very hard to learn the long lost art of patience.

[John Olsen 1]

Well, maybe this will sound like overkill...I have a kind of gas mask thing that I bought when painting my boat with some rather nasty two pot paint. It works really well for that, so I have taken to using it when doping fabric onto wings. When you do this you cannot smell the acetone, so it really works. (Nor could I smell the boat paint through them.) I presume it would probably work just as well for stopping the smell of the CA glue, although I haven't tried it for that. You can buy this sort of thing at the safety equipment shops. It doesn't need an air supply, it has two replaceable capsules. The advice I was given was that when you start to smell the solvent, it is time to replace them. Of course this would not stop the fumes getting to your eyes unless you buy goggles as well.

John

[GrahamC]

I'm now very very intolerant to ordinary CA, and it produces unpleasant respiratory symptoms through the evening and night after use. I've realised now that even the 'I've only got this little bit to do, and I'll do it outside the shed in the fresh air" moment has to be avoided.

On the other hand odourless foam safe CA is not a problem at all. So my solution now is that I only ever use foam safe.

The masks (I have one) are, if I remember rightly, designed to exclude organic solvents. I have no idea if the mask will work, but I'm not going to try!

[Bob Cotsford]

just remember that most of the filters on these masks need replacing at regular intervals, the one I've got says 28 days.

I don't get on at all well with cyno fumes as a rule, but I've found Wickes Mitre Glue one of the least offensive. It's a thick cyno and is around £11 for 3 *50gm bottles. I've tried foam safe on EPO, Elapor and the like and can't get a good bond with it.

[fly boy3]

Lethal fumes, the answer is if you must use it , is lots of ventilation. 2 years ago I suffered respiratory problems when using CA in an unventilated position and had to seek the doctors help. I still use it but always outside. .Cheers.ps google CA and you will be suprised.,

Edited By fly boy3 on 03/07/2012 11:17:59

[Romeo Whisky]

Yep - me too. And the trouble is that virtually nothing else works on Elapor/EPO foam. (Do NOT rely on epoxy or PVA for these kinds of foam). Like JO1 above, I bought a "gas mask" (£20 from Screwfix) which has solved the problem for me.

[Martyn K]

I have just snipped this from Wikipedia - save you looking it up... Note the bit at the bottom about Nitromethane being a solvent for CA

<snip>

Toxicity

The fumes from CA are a vaporized form of the cyanoacrylate monomer that irritate sensitive membranes in the eyes, nose, and throat. They are immediately polymerized by the moisture in the membranes and become inert. These risks can be minimized by using CA in well ventilated areas. About 5% of the population can become sensitized to CA fumes after repeated exposure, resulting in flu-like symptoms. It may also act as a skin irritant and may cause an allergic skin reaction. The ACGIH assign a Threshold Limit Valueexposure limit of 200 parts per billion. On rare occasions, inhalation may trigger asthma. There is no singular measurement of toxicity for all cyanoacrylate adhesives as there is a wide variety of adhesives that contain various cyanoacrylate formulations.

The United States National Toxicology Program and the United Kingdom Health and Safety Executive have concluded that the use of ethyl cyanoacrylate is safe and that additional study is unnecessary. 2-octyl cyanoacrylate degrades much more slowly due to its longer organic backbone that slows the degradation of the adhesive enough to remain below the threshold of tissue toxicity.

[edit]Reaction with cotton

Applying cyanoacrylate to materials made of cotton or wool (such as cotton swabs, cotton balls, and certain yarns or fabrics) results in a powerful, rapid exothermic reaction. The heat released may cause serious burns, ignite the cotton product, or release irritating white smoke. Material Safety Data Sheets for cyanoacrylate instruct users not to wear cotton or wool clothing, especially cotton gloves, when applying or handling cyanoacrylates.

[edit]Solvents and debonders

Acetone is a widely available solvent capable of softening cured cyanoacrylate. Other solvents include Nitromethane,

</snip>

I suppose that it may be obvious, but Nitromethane is a CA solvent. You may want to think twice about using it in exposed areas where nitro may be present...

Martyn

[GrahamC]

Well polyeurethane type glues do work on foams. There is almost more glue than foam in my Wot4 Foam-e. Try "Joiners Mate" from Screwfix. Very like Gorilla glue, just a bit runnier and much cheaper. The only thing is that it is messy - not good for visible joins.

Some of the guys at the club use what looks like a low foam Polyeurethane glue that is blue. It sticks really well. I don't know what it is. I've been promised a pot, but its not materialised yet!

[John Robertson 3]

Yesterday, I was working on the wing of a COSMO 10SR - a Korean high-wing power job - and started coughing. As I am currently undergoing tests for a long-running chest infection (antibiotics, proton pump inhibitor (??), chest X-Ray, poo-sample) I thought nothing of it. The 'plane is something which my grandchildren's father started building in Stockholm in about 1990. His father thought it would be something they could do together and off they went. Eventually, the project was sidelined as neither had the skills required. However, on a visit to Sweden in September his sister pulled out a black plastic bag full of bits and pieces from the loft and I was surprised how well they had actually done, given that they used a Swiss Army Knife for cutting out ribs etc. I offered to have a go at the build and spread the plane through various suitcases and got it home. The fuselage had survived perfectly, but the glue in the wing structure fared less well, but nothing that couldn't be fixed with some judicious CA and Deluxe's Superphatic. I set-to yesterday and worked mainly with CA for an afternoon. Up close, peering into the wing between the webs . . .

That evening, I thought my ribs would break and my head explode! Wheezing, coughing, snottering, not snottering - the lot! I thought that if my breathing got any worse I'd be visiting A&E or making that 999 call. Whilst waiting to die, it occurred to me that it might NOT be my chest infection getting worse. Could it be that I had pushed it too hard on the cyano? A web search led me to this old thread and all became clear as my symptoms were described by others. Well done those members!

I began to feel better towards 1am and managed to get some sleep, and by 9am actually felt that I would like some food. By Noon I was out flying my Robotbirds - supplied Mininprop Felix IQ XL converted chuck-glider as in http://www.modelflying.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=127942&p=8 with a Mobius mounted for the first time, with a repeat session at 1600, curtailed by rapidly-falling dusk.

I am now looking for a suitable face-mask so that I can continue to use CA (I have a couple of Multiplex Elapor models to "build" and Zacki CA is the only recommended adhesive). Does anyone have any experience of those on offer in Screwfix's catalogue or of other offerings?

I have chosen to post on this thread as it may help others come to terms with the problem or act as a warning to newcomers - "don't push your luck"!

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

I get hay fever bad n I'm a gardener.

You're taking precautions now David, it ain't weird and maybe not down to the lay off.

I before E except after C ?

[Piers Bowlan]

John (Robertson), I bought one of these 3M facemarks from Screwfix. I bought it for antifouling a friends boat as the process is hazardous. I have also used it when topping my field as I suffer from hay fever. I may look weird wearing it driving my tractor but at least I get to finish the field! I also use it for any serious CA/balsa sessions, I am not sensitised to CA yet but I wish to keep it that way!

[Peter Miller]

Many years agoe when I was writing "The Engine Bay" an aeromodelling doctor wrote to me after I had mentioned allergies.

He told me that in a factory where people where soldering up electronic circuits they became ill.

IT was traced to the fact that the components where held in place with CA and the heat released Cyanide gas. which the people were absorbing

[trebor]

I'm the same with a runny nose, the first time it happened was at the same time the farmer was cutting the crops down so it went on for weeks till i figured it out. Just make sure you open a window and I now stick tissue up my nose and breath through the mouth which helps

[John Robertson 3]

"I now stick tissue up my nose" plus a pair of pencils for the ears and Blackadder rides again!

[Keith Evans 3]

I suffered badly from hay fever since my teens .I was given every cure around with little or no effect .The drugs at that time made you very drowsy . So when I was sitting my O and A levels I could not stay awake in the day time and I was up most of the night with asthma attacks .No allowance in those days was given to these conditions .Talk about stress at school,the kids nowadays have it easy .Switch to Yorkshire men relating the story of the good old days .The first hope I had was when I was given a steroid injection .It was the magic bullet .Symptoms disappeared over night and lasted the whole season .Next year it took two jabs .I thought ,if I keep on this way I'll be developing things I didn't want . I was eventually referred to an asthma clinic in my 30's where over the winter months I was given ever increasing injections of my particular allergy------- grass pollen . This course took 5 years to compete and although I still occasionally have some symptoms it a thousand times better . No longer do I need to stuff tissues up my nose but I do however still take all the sensible precautions . I'm not sure if this treatment is still available as it puts quite a strain on the system . I still buy over the counter medication just to be on the safe side particularly when I travel abroad .I still have some in the house and a while back I found I was allergic to an antibiotic I was given by my dentist ,the old symptoms returned with a vengeance ---he he I said I think I'm allergic to this ----took an antihistamine and the problem went away .Stopped taking the drugs and was given another type and all was well .Yes allergic reactions are not nice at all .

[Peter Miller]

Thd Pilot kits from the 70s had a small bottle of liquid glue for the plastic cowls.

I started off getting watery eyes after about three attacks one eye became a real mess, looked like a lump of mince. It was so bad that when I took my mother to the Eye Clinic after a cataract operation they whipped me straight in to see the specialist as the nurse was so horrified at the state of me eye

I still did not realise what was causing it but them I had another attack and it clicked. I was blind for three days. Some solvents still make my sinuses clog but never had anything like that since. It was frightening.

I did mention it in RCM&E at the time but no one ever replied.

[Joe Beavis]

I have used a 4" dia cabinet fan with a length of flexible ducting led out through the wall for very effective local fume extraction. Remember that air out needs air in!

I know that some people are affected by the merest whiff of CA, but this might serve for the borderline cases - it is cold outside at the momen for outdoor CA work!

Joe Beavis

[John Robertson 3]

Thank you all - very helpful.

Piers - I've had a look at the mask and it sounds just the ticket.

Joe - a grand idea. I built a new shed for modelling last winter but have yet to move in as I can cope in my old shed and I MUST keep the missus happy gardening, cycling, "spending quality time" with her etc. during the other 3 seasons. Power is laid in but that's it. I'll be back in there soon, so I can build myself an extractor-booth area with as many fans and ducts as I like.

From Peter and Keith's comments, it sounds like I've had a relatively easy time of it and should heed my body's warnings.