GrumpyGnome Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 I recently acquired a used TT 54 Four Stroke. Looks pretty good internally and externally but: 1) it'll only idle with the carb barrel opening about 50% visible. Is that normal? 2) The club 'engine whisperer' is unable to tune it to his satisfaction and feels the LS needle is way too lean but is concerned it's already open about 8 turns (it just passes the hiss test) 3) he is also a little concerned that the HS needle is open about 4 turns. So.... does anyone have one of these engines? Do these needle setting seem odd? Do you have a manual? Thanks in advance. P.S. it may be a pile if pooh but I didn't pay much for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 The TT54's were great engines so.. 1. No, that sounds wonkey to me 2. cant tune engines by counting turns, just keep going. If it falls out, something is wrong. 3. This sounds wrong too. Even though you cant tune engines by counting turns, 4 on a main is clearly excessive. I would first strip the carb and make sure there isnt something blocking it. Then check the valve clearance, and while you are at it check the cam timing. I have met two TT engines from new that came with incorrect timing. Both were 75's but even if the factory got it right there is no guarantee a modeller with no self control didnt take it apart 'just to see how it works' and put it back together wrong. It sounds like a joke, but its not. I get it all the time. What else...? What prop, plug, fuel, top end RPM do you get? Also if you have a video of the beast in action that can be very informative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveman Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 Hi GG, Attached are two manuals, one specifically for the FS54, and the other a general TT FS manual from Ripmax. GDB Thunder Tiger 54 4T 9800-JA0262V2-manual.pdf Thunder Tiger FS engines.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Engine Doctor Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 Has the engine been stripped ? If it has since running properly then suggest that valve timing is wrong . Its very easy to put camshaft back in one tooth out. The fact that the carb has ti be 50 % open for it to idle I would certainly check timing and valves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted February 14, 2023 Author Share Posted February 14, 2023 2 hours ago, Jon - Laser Engines said: The TT54's were great engines so.. 1. No, that sounds wonkey to me 2. cant tune engines by counting turns, just keep going. If it falls out, something is wrong. 3. This sounds wrong too. Even though you cant tune engines by counting turns, 4 on a main is clearly excessive. I would first strip the carb and make sure there isnt something blocking it. Then check the valve clearance, and while you are at it check the cam timing. I have met two TT engines from new that came with incorrect timing. Both were 75's but even if the factory got it right there is no guarantee a modeller with no self control didnt take it apart 'just to see how it works' and put it back together wrong. It sounds like a joke, but its not. I get it all the time. What else...? What prop, plug, fuel, top end RPM do you get? Also if you have a video of the beast in action that can be very informative. Cheers Jon Prop is 11x6, tried a wooden one and a much heavier glass/nylon one (not a Master!) OS F plug - brand new Weston Prosynth 10% nitro No idea on revs - must take my tacho out of it's little pouch and use it...... I'll take a video next time I try. In the meantime, looks like a strip down is needed. All adds to the fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted February 14, 2023 Author Share Posted February 14, 2023 1 hour ago, Caveman said: Hi GG, Attached are two manuals, one specifically for the FS54, and the other a general TT FS manual from Ripmax. GDB Thunder Tiger 54 4T 9800-JA0262V2-manual.pdf 775.23 kB · 0 downloads Thunder Tiger FS engines.pdf 12.36 MB · 0 downloads Perfect. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted February 14, 2023 Author Share Posted February 14, 2023 4 minutes ago, Engine Doctor said: Has the engine been stripped ? If it has since running properly then suggest that valve timing is wrong . Its very easy to put camshaft back in one tooth out. The fact that the carb has ti be 50 % open for it to idle I would certainly check timing and valves. No idea tbh. Bought it second hand..... I'll check the valves, and clean up the carb before looking at the timing. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted February 15, 2023 Share Posted February 15, 2023 13 hours ago, GrumpyGnome said: Cheers Jon Prop is 11x6, tried a wooden one and a much heavier glass/nylon one (not a Master!) OS F plug - brand new Weston Prosynth 10% nitro No idea on revs - must take my tacho out of it's little pouch and use it...... I'll take a video next time I try. In the meantime, looks like a strip down is needed. All adds to the fun! 11x6 is a bit small but will not be causing your problem. 12x6 is my go to for a 50 class 4 stroke. Plug is good Fuel... awful. Beyond my normal view of this fuel i tested it on a friends TT91 4 stroke and just wouldnt run right no matter what we did. As soon as we switched to any of the other 3 fuels we had on hand it ran fine. If you have something else i would try it. And yep, time to get the spanners out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Davis Posted February 15, 2023 Share Posted February 15, 2023 I strongly suspect that there's dirt in the carb. These are great engines. I won the four-stroke class of La Coupe Des Barons with a TT54FS in 2021. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted February 15, 2023 Author Share Posted February 15, 2023 So.... carby stripped and cleaned - bit cruddy but ok; o-rings seem fine (good job really as a set off t'internet is more than 50% of what I paid for the engine valves adjusted slightly timing seems ok needles set by the 'blow' method Need to create a test rig so I can fire it up in the garden...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Engine Doctor Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 You say valve timing appears OK. Did you check if valves are on the rock at TDC ? Or take off the cam cover and check the cam visually ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted February 16, 2023 Author Share Posted February 16, 2023 (edited) The latter... glow plug out, piston at top, look for the 'pip' on the cam Edited February 16, 2023 by GrumpyGnome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 (edited) 12 hours ago, GrumpyGnome said: needles set by the 'blow' method The TT54 has an air bleed carb if i remember rightly. If so the blow test will not work Had a look, seems to be two versions of the engine. One with airbleed and one with TN Edited February 16, 2023 by Jon - Laser Engines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted February 16, 2023 Author Share Posted February 16, 2023 Mine's the twin needle type - no air bleed screw 🙂 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halsey Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 (edited) Hi, I have just acquired a new one of these engines (9800) from a club member so know it is genuine and un-damaged but I am struggling to identify the various parts prior to setting it up and running it for (mine and its) first time. Only headed for a test stand at present - ultimately intended for a Magnatilla (when I've built it!) I really do only want something very basic showing where to connect the "fuel" pipes what is to be adjusted and what to leave alone. Also I am NOT knowledgeable on the subject so please keep it basic Can I stress I haven't done anything with it yet I'm just trying to get my "ducks in a row". Hoping someone can help or refer me to a source of info. Clearly my club could help but it's that time of year when we don't get together and I have only just joined as returning flying after 40 years off so am not really established as yet! Thanks Edited November 7, 2023 by Halsey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denis Watkins Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 (edited) Just looked Halsey, On YouTube Loads of modellers showing pipe work for bench running Edited November 7, 2023 by Denis Watkins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted November 7, 2023 Share Posted November 7, 2023 Be aware that these engines can inflict serious injury so if you can enlist help, so much the better. An electric starter is safest for a beginner, followed by a “chicken” stick or purpose designed finger stall. Plumbing - it’s usual to have a weighted “clunk” in the tank to feed fuel, a vent pipe with a removable bung for filling and a connection to the silencer nipple. Some prefer not to use a pressurised system - in this case you just need an open vent pipe. Proper tightening of the prop nut and matching lock nut is of utmost importance - a propeller being thrown is dangerous/damaging - this can happen very quickly if you lean out the engine too much. I’ve seen many supposedly tightened propellers come loose - my suspicion is that people are frightened of stripping threads. With conventional sized spanners (well fitting ring spanners please!) my advice is to hand tighten each in turn against the propeller until you feel your eyeballs starting to bulge! Ensure an area clear of loose items, trip hazards, pets, children and other casual onlookers. Don’t underestimate the power produced - it can tip an unrestrained Workmate. NEVER stand in front of the engine while applying any power - start it at a fast tickover, move carefully round behind the prop and to remove the glow - don’t EVER reach over the prop to do it. Lots of potential problems with a stored engine so once again, having someone familiar with glow operation would be preferable if at all possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masher Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 J Martin's post is good. However, if you can wait until after your holiday, I will help you with the engine. It is too easy to damage yourself or the engine if you have no experience. Speak when we next meet! Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halsey Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 3 hours ago, Masher said: J Martin's post is good. However, if you can wait until after your holiday, I will help you with the engine. It is too easy to damage yourself or the engine if you have no experience. Speak when we next meet! Martin e-mailed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halsey Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 Thanks for the various comments - for some reason I wasn't notified the posts had happened must check my settings. For those who don't know me - ("Masher") I am careful and won't rush in, I am "familiar" with the dangers involved (I am using electric powered planes at present) and am sensible and I did all this 40 years ago! BUT never to old to learn and avail myself of tips - I will search YouTube using different search words Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 Beware of some instructional youtube videos. Many of them just parrot ancient folk lore and youtube has the ability to turn any mug with a camera into an 'expert' irrespective of their actual credentials, or lack of same. The TT54 was a great little engine and one of the best 50 class motors i have used. 5/15 fuel, 12x6 (13x5 will be better for the magnatilla) prop, tank in the right place etc. Just tune it up and go fly, nothing to worry about. It will be way more than you need for the mag so no worries about the power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halsey Posted November 8, 2023 Share Posted November 8, 2023 YouTube credentials issue understood - the, very limited, manual suggests 11x5 for running in so I have now bought 2 and I'm going to use Westons Liquid Gold 10% fuel now bought 1 gallon based on general club use/advice. Thanks for the input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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