Looking for a plan to suit a newbie builder. 4 channel cabin style.

[kevin b]

I have a young neighbour (17 years old), who has been flying foamies for a while and wants to build an ic powered model.

He likes the Peggy Sue 2, but I think it is too advanced for him.

Any suggestions for a similar style model up to 50ins span please.

His current build is the Mignon. I am advising, but making him build the model himself.

[David Davis]

 If he will go a bit bigger I'd recommend the Keil Kraft Super 60 https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=4059 or Telemaster 40 https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=9384. Plans available on The Outerzone.

 

Ben Buckle offers a kit of the Super 60 with ailerons too. https://www.benbucklevintage.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_4&products_id=12. The four channel plan is also available for £13.50.

 

This is what they look like. You could always make the wings in two halves with joining rods and tubes if space is at a premium.

[kevin b]

Thanks David.

I'm looking for something in the .15 to .32 size as he has no ic experience at all.

There are lots of 3 channel designs which I could alter and reduce the dihedral, but I would prefer an "off the shelf" plan.

The main criteria is that it looks more like a scale model than a trainer.

[Alan Gorham_]

What about the plan for the old pilot kits Citabria 20? Perfect for a 25 2-stroke and capable of beyter than trainer like performance. Plan with all parts shown is available on outerzone 

[Nigel Sharp]

RMtrainer plans on outerzone.

https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=6001

 

Simple build.

 

 

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Radio Modeller trainer, with ailerons is a good choice, had one myself.

 

[Alan Gorham_]

How does suggesting plans for a trainer fill the brief of "looking more like a scale model than a trainer"? 

[kevin b]

Nice one Alan. I had missed that one.

However, with most of the kit plans there is a problem with the cowl as they are usually vacuum formed.

 

Everyone's assistance so far is much appreciated.

[Nigel Sharp]

A good dose of artistic licence and a good colour scheme!!!

 

Still a simple build and more than a good chance of successful build plus first flights. And plenty of options to play with.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Add a few rivets. 😉

[kc]

There is the Jack Headley 52 inch  Piper Cub on Outerzone - no glazed cabin sides just balsa, very simple.   Numerous glazed Cubs like Phil Kent's Clipped Wing Cub ( built  by someone on this forum with the details discussed )

 

If he likes Peggy Sue 2 then surely it's best to build what you really like.   Building something you like probably gets finished!   Good experience building from strip balsa

[David Davis 2]

4 hours ago, kevin b said:

Thanks David.

I'm looking for something in the .15 to .32 size as he has no ic experience at all.

There are lots of 3 channel designs which I could alter and reduce the dihedral, but I would prefer an "off the shelf" plan.

The main criteria is that it looks more like a scale model than a trainer.

 

I flew both the full size Super 60 and a Telemaster 66 on a Merco 35 so I don't think that a modern 32 would have any difficulty flying either, then there's always the Mini Super if you want to go smaller. As for scale looks, I've always thought that a Super 60 looks a bit like an Auster.

 

Going for scale appearance at your young protegés stage of the learning curve could be problematical, cowled engine, cooling and inaccessible needles are just three of the problems you'll have to overcome.  

 

[Jonathan M]

I'd agree with kc - if a design captures the imagination then that's pretty critical as it'll provide a huge amount of positive momentum even if the build level is a bit more 'intermediate' than 'beginner' and takes a bit longer.

 

And you say he's been flying foamies for a while and is currently building a Mignon?  In that case something like the RM trainer, while providing more basic building experience, isn't going to excite him construction-wise, nor will it be that interesting in flying potential (flat bottomed wing) to take him to the next level.

 

How about looking at the original Peggy Sue design?  Bang on 50" span, semi-symmetrical section, for 20-25 two-strokes (or 26-30 four-strokes) and a reasonably modest wing-loading for its size of 17oz/ft2.

 

Peggy Sue 50" Plan & Article

 

That's all assuming that you're happy to continue to mentor the lad and guide him through the more tricky bits...!?

 

 

Edited October 20, 2023 by Jonathan M

[Jonathan M]

Another alternative is the 47" low-wing Amelia by Dereck Woodward.  This is also very nicely scale-like, also with a semi-symmetrical wing for more engaging flying performance, but would be simpler to build than the Peggy Sue, and has the advantage of an upright engine configuration (20 2-str or 25 4-str) with removable hatch for easy access.

 

Amelia 47" Plan & Article

 

(I'll confess to a personal interest here, as I have a NIB OS 30FS looking for a suitable airframe... and several currently-unallocated winter building months ahead!)

 

Edited October 21, 2023 by Jonathan M

[Rich Griff]

Amelia from a free plan.

 

I am sure I have the magazine and plan as it is on my to make list, BUT...

 

Back in the day I flew one of these made by s fellow club member. I seemed nose heavy on the sticks.

 

On its third flight of the day after two easy non aerobatic flights, it clapped its wings, looked as if the port wing failed close to the fuz in a gentle turn and bank to starboard.

 

Beef up the wing spars is all I can say.

 

I have no idea of the members build quality but had seen many of his models fly with no problems. The amilia was his first "structural failure" as far as I know/remember.

[Jonathan M]

Who knows what excess flying loads or landing-shocks your club-mate's Amelia might have had before that fateful day (a progressive weakening of the wing) but looking at the plan there's certainly no sheer-webbing shown between the spars - however this is an easy fix.

 

The other mod I'd make is to fit separate aileron servos.

 

Re being nose-heavy on the sticks, I wonder whether that was simply because the CG was too far forward?

 

For my part, also, I imagine the 30FS might be too heavy or too much for this model - unless it was scaled it up say 10%?

[Christopher Wolfe]

On 21/10/2023 at 02:57, kevin b said:

Thanks David.

I'm looking for something in the .15 to .32 size as he has no ic experience at all.

There are lots of 3 channel designs which I could alter and reduce the dihedral, but I would prefer an "off the shelf" plan.

The main criteria is that it looks more like a scale model than a trainer.

 

This model is an oldie but a goody Veron Super Robot.

 

It is a little larger than your requirements but on the plus side, it is easy to build, can be dressed up to look like a light aircraft and suits your power requirements.

 

My son built one when he was 14 years old (supervised) and it survived for many years until the OS 25 literally wore out.

 

I learned to fly with it's predecessor Veron Robot which suits your size requirements.

 

Tough as nails it was my second r/c model; covered in silk and powered with an Enya .09 it survived long enough to be donated as a club trainer.

 

With the dihedral reduced and modern lightweight r/c gear I reckon that it would be a decent first 'plan build'.

 

(I wonder how many others on this forum remember the Veron Robot)

 

* Chris *

[Outrunner]

Last year I built. Veron mini-Robot from the Outerzone plan, only 36" span but with a little electric motor it's a hoot to fly http://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=10900

[Jonathan M]

Kevin - any feedback from your apprentice on the offerings so far suggested?

 

In the meantime, here's another one to consider:  Coachman 53in for .20 to .30 engines

[Nigel R]

https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=12174

 

looks like a homebuilt, near fun fly performance, 40 size power

 

not sure if that's at "the right" construction level, its fairly similar in build style to peggy sue