How far do you fly??

[Spice Cat]

What with the lousy weather and all I am back to musing on things flying and other less important subjects.

I know it's sometimes difficult to judge distance to a model you are flying, but how far do you think you are most comfortable with?

For me I think the maximum is about two hundred metres.

[Phil Green]

I find it very hard to tell, my depth perception is quite poor. Driving down the lane to the field we often see people flying beyond the boundaries, when its mentioned they're horrified, unaware they were so far out.
Maybe the trend for much larger models hasnt helped. Its hard to see a Sharkface beyond 200 metres!

Maybe we could make better use of the ring-fencing techniques provided by some telemetry systems.

 

Edited By Phil Green on 01/12/2015 22:13:45

[Geoff S]

I would think 200 metres for me at the most. I have an altimeter on my Phoenix 2000 and I only allow it to climb to 200 metres in very good visibility because I can hardly see it in anything other than that.

There'a wind turbine right on the edge of the airfield and it seems a long way away but the FPV quad pilots who have flown round it and back say it's only 1/2 mile according to their GPS readings. There's no way I'd fly anywhere like that far away.

Geoff

[ChrisB]

Using good old Google maps i've measured the area we fly in and its about 300m. I've done it with other clubs i've flown at and its about the same.

With models getting both smaller and larger at the same time the distances will vary more significantly than the old days.

As with Phil's club we are often surprised how far out we fly. To some extent it depends on the field layout and local restrictions.

Google is a good tool though. If you don't know, right mouse click and then click measure distance and away you go.

[Frank Skilbeck]

Posted by Phil Green on 01/12/2015 22:10:37:

Maybe we could make better use of the ring-fencing techniques provided by some telemetry systems.

Edited By Phil Green on 01/12/2015 22:13:45

You can put height and distance alarms on the one's I've got, but setting up a ring fence where the distance in one direction is less than in another wouldn't be possible. But who knows in the future you may be able to mark something out on google maps and upload it.

BTW 500m high is about my limit, but that's with a 4.2m glider

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Posted by Geoff Sleath on 01/12/2015 22:29:56:

I would think 200 metres for me at the most. I have an altimeter on my Phoenix 2000 and I only allow it to climb to 200 metres in very good visibility because I can hardly see it in anything other than that.

There'a wind turbine right on the edge of the airfield and it seems a long way away but the FPV quad pilots who have flown round it and back say it's only 1/2 mile according to their GPS readings. There's no way I'd fly anywhere like that far away.

Geoff

I assume their safety observers have better eyesight than yours, Geoff?

[PeterF]

This is an interesting question and one which our club faced when there was a proposal for a near by wind farm. I put an Eagle Tree GPS logger into a few planes, then downloaded the data and imported it into Google Earth. I have attached a couple of the traces. On one I had 3 flights with my Topflite DC3 (2m / 80" wingspan). The next is a compilation of 5 flights with my Flair Lark 70, a small older design F3A type plane (1.55m / 62" wingspan). I read a lot of the BMFA guidance on flying field layout as we were going to need to move the runway and flying area had the turbines been built. BMFA recommend a flying area of 300m x 600m centered on the runway, i.e. you fly up to 300m in front and to both sides of your location. My flight patterns pretty much fell into that box with a small proportion going outside. With the DC3 at 2m wingspan I could have flown further without loss of orientation. The DC3 track is quite open with mainly flying large circuits and figures of 8 with large sweeping turns. On the Lark flight tracks do not worry about the short vertical legs that appear to cross the road, that was just the GPS initial boot up getting the location of the pits sorted out as more satellites got picked up and the accuracy settled down. The Lark flights are much closer in and denseley packed with lots of aerobatics, stall turns, etc and I could easily have kept that in a 400m x 200m box but I took a few circuits to see where I was comfortable up to with the smaller plane.

Luckily, the turbine planning application has been withdrawn, some of you may have noticed the marker pin with the title T6 to the left of the flying zone on the DC3 plot, that is where one of the turbines would have been sited, and with a 50m blade radius and a 50m exclusion zone (minimum) there was a huge clash.

DC3

Lark

[J D 8]

A good job there Peter and that probably covers most club members flying,anyone have a jet with you that could carry the tracker ? We have a couple in the club and they do seam to eat up lot of sky.

I happen to have very good long range vision and so do tend to fly further away than most, to the point that when others ask me where my aircraft is and I give a direction they still can not see it.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[PeterF]

Posted by john davies 8 on 02/12/2015 11:52:51:

A good job there Peter and that probably covers most club members flying,anyone have a jet with you that could carry the tracker ? We have a couple in the club and they do seam to eat up lot of sky.

We do not have any jets at the club, there have been comments from the landowner about noise from jets and there is a village not to far away. We have one or two members with larger aerobatic petrol models 2.5 to 3m span and they have flown further out at times. The road in the images is a private gated access road into the farm only which eases are concerns about flying slightly wider than I have shown.

If you have something like the DC3, then you really can not fly it in a smaller area or it just does not look right doing pylon turns.

[Dickw]

With my 2m gliders I often fly at 300m altitude, and probably the same distance out at that altitude. Lower down I would be comfortable flying further out – so probably an overall line of sight distance of around 400 to 450m is my maximum comfortable distance with that size model.

I have been further up and out in competitions but it does build up the stress level even though we have a timekeeper to help keep track of it. While timekeeping/helping a fellow competitor, I once had to watch his 2m glider while he was at 600m altitude. I could see it, but was glad I wasn’t flying it.

My smaller models are flown a lot closer in.

Dick

[perttime]

People with big gliders often go high.

The jet modelers in my area use a couple of friendly full-size airfields. With some new regulations in force, the manager of one applied for a permanent 1500 metre ceiling for model aircraft for "his" field...

[Dickw]

Almost puts them in the "mile high club" .

Dick

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Erfolg]

Apparently I have flown a model 930 yards from where I have been standing, the model being at a good height. being observed by another club member coming to the field. The measurement is using Google Earth.

The model was a 2m glider, at such a distance the model has to essentially fly itself.

I was aware that it was along way out. It was brought back I assume at this distance as it was uncomfortable, on the basis it was verging on being dangerous, in that a mistake would be difficult to rectify.

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Posted by Steve J on 02/12/2015 17:43:32:

Posted by perttime on 02/12/2015 16:41:20:

1500 metre ceiling for model aircraft for "his" field...

Please clarify this. Above ground level or above sea level? If it is the latter, what altitude is field at? I can't see how you could maintain direct unaided visual contact with a model at 1500m AGL.

Steve

Probably a typo for feet?

While I'm here, the furthest I can recall is, according to Google Maps and the onboard camera, about 600m with my 1/4 scale Cub (106" - which felt perfectly comfortable.

(Oh, and there was the time a pupil's 8 foot span trainer decided to ignore all inputs and went off downwind in a climbing spiral - it got to the point where all that could be discerned was a flash of sunlight from the wings every revolution...never to be seen or heard of (thankfully!?!?) again.)

Edited By Martin Harris on 02/12/2015 19:23:58

[perttime]

Posted by Martin Harris on 02/12/2015 19:07:40:

Posted by Steve J on 02/12/2015 17:43:32:

Posted by perttime on 02/12/2015 16:41:20:

1500 metre ceiling for model aircraft for "his" field...

Please clarify this. Above ground level or above sea level? If it is the latter, what altitude is field at? I can't see how you could maintain direct unaided visual contact with a model at 1500m AGL.

Steve

Probably a typo for feet?

Nope.

I just went and checked his post on a local forum:

The new model flying height regulation came pretty surprising and quick, so the first thing he did was to apply for a NOTAM, valid until further notice.

Translation: Model aircraft activity Surface-> 5000 ft MSL from runways 15/33 and 09/27

The field is EFJM, 154m / 505ft above sea level.

**LINK**

Apparently, 1000 metres is not all that much for large jet models and large (LARGE) gliders.

Edited By perttime on 02/12/2015 19:39:10

[PeterF]

Oh, and there was the time a pupil's 8 foot span trainer decided to ignore all inputs and went off downwind in a climbing spiral - it got to the point where all that could be discerned was a flash of sunlight from the wings every revolution...never to be seen or heard of (thankfully!?!?) again.)

We had one like that, last seen heading off over the North Sea.

I have just looked at the Eagle Tree data for my 2.5m electric glider, no trouble 600m away at 320m above ground level, probably benn further and higher, nearly lost sight in a thermal once but did not have the logger on board that day.

Edited By PeterF on 02/12/2015 19:47:42

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[perttime]

Some of the guys do big loops with their jets. They don't tend to stay high for long.

6 or 7 metre span scale gliders should be easy to see pretty high.

[Spice Cat]

Posted by Dave Smith 15 on 02/12/2015 20:13:58:

Having spent 16 years living (and flying models) in Finland, I can assure you that that is true. I frequently flew my 3.5 metre thermal soarer to the point at which I was being directed as to what control inputs to make by a friend standing next to me with a pair of powerful binoculars.

Erm, what were your trying to do; set an altitude record????

[Broken Prop]

Around the other side of that Oak tree..................you know the one I mean SC?

[Martyn K]

Posted by Spice Cat on 02/12/2015 21:45:01:

Posted by Dave Smith 15 on 02/12/2015 20:13:58:

Having spent 16 years living (and flying models) in Finland, I can assure you that that is true. I frequently flew my 3.5 metre thermal soarer to the point at which I was being directed as to what control inputs to make by a friend standing next to me with a pair of powerful binoculars.

Erm, what were your trying to do; set an altitude record????

I have been in a similar situation when slope soaring on the Pennines. A 3.7m span glider with 300m chord was literally a point speck above me. I had absolutely no idea what the controls were doing or even which direction it was pointing.

I used to fly free flight competitions. I know how big a 2m span model looks when it is 1.5 miles down wind - approx 7,500 - 8000 feet - and I would guess it was above that - possibly going on for 2 miles vertically upwards. Eventually got it down by spinning it out but still managed to crash it as it didn't recover.

Thank goodness it was on 27MHz with true Line of Sight Range.

By the way - it wasn't that intentional, just incredibly strong wave lift assisted by a big thermal. I was well out of my depth.

Martyn

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]