Ernie Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Mon dieu? Magic smoke pales into insignificance. What happens if something goes wrong (it often does for me) ernie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeno7 Posted March 4 Author Share Posted March 4 It... goes wrong? Ive never had a flight without some issue. Ardupilot has a warning system where if you have telemetry to your RC, Mission Planner or OSD set up, it can try detect obvious issues and warn you (like a battery cell deciding to abandon life) Depends on the issue, give me an example. Obviously Ardupilot will not save your plane if the servo powering ailerons or elevators fail, at that point you have to switch to manual. But that is kinda rare @Ernie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeno7 Posted March 4 Author Share Posted March 4 It can also be programmed to land your plane if worst case scenario your RC fails. Although this should be tested by entering RTH mode via a switch/Mission Planner because auto-land is not 100% accurate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Well, lets say 1 the elevator falls off or 2 a soldered connection to the battery fails ernie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeno7 Posted March 4 Author Share Posted March 4 (edited) well honestly you'd lose the plane no matter what if the elevator falls off unless you get very lucky with an elevator-less landing which in my opinion is likely impossible and this isn't really specific to Ardupilot but you can have a backup BEC wired to the servos and autopilot - maybe that will let you glide to a safe landing you check this stuff preflight Edited March 4 by Xeno7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 How does the magic wee arduino know what to do if the model has no elevators (they've fallen off) and no power(a soldered connection has come loose) ernie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeno7 Posted March 4 Author Share Posted March 4 No power - unless you have wired it up for backup power, it will sort of not know. At that point it's like unplugging a battery. UNLESS you are lucky, and it's the ESC side of things that has failed, at which point you have lost power and kept your servos active. I think if configured correctly it will pitch down and start to glide when speed starts to drop to avoid stalling. You'd have to take control to glide it to a safe landing. If the elevators are gone we've talked about this. Your plane kind of drops out of the sky because no pitch control. There is nothing the Ardupilot (or you) can really do. Although maybe you will get lucky with where it ends up and how it crashes. It's a stupid and rare scenario to happen unless doing things you should not do like acrobatics with a glider that is flying above recommended take off weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leccyflyer Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 All of which sound like excellent reasons not to even embark on such a foolhardy exercise as flying long range BVLOS with hobby grade equipment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeno7 Posted March 4 Author Share Posted March 4 When you do long range you sort of accept that you are flying in a high risk scenario and if something goes wrong you might not get the plane back. Then again the above mentioned scenarios are rare, and if you lose pitch you likely will lose your plane anyway, or get it back in too many pieces for repair. Anyway, leaving this post. I got the info I need and if anyone has any more Ardupilot questions go ask them in https://discuss.ardupilot.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 (edited) I guess the skill and fun is in preparing the model, and programming the flight controller. Then chuck it in the air and hope it does what you want, as all the gadgets and gizmos enabling you to see what's happening must have some range limitations. It's flying 'a la Amazon delivery drone'.......... and I assume insurance is costly, and red tape abounds. Losing a model would be the least of my worries. Edited March 4 by GrumpyGnome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 So here we are with a model with no elevators, no power, 50 miles away from the pilot, and maybe over a motorway, or autoroute or whatever. Not a very good idea ernie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeno7 Posted March 4 Author Share Posted March 4 Since for some weird reason this forum did not save that I unfollowed this post I will answer what you said quickly Firstly, Ardupilot is used commercially. It is very reliable if you set it up correctly. Secondly, @Ernie, that scenario you posted just now is rare, a bit stupid to worry about it, and I am not going to be over a motorway, the nearest motorway to my flying location is about 3km away (google maps). No insurance is needed for under 20kg - it is optional. And honestly nobody I have heard of flies with insurance (my friends). Thirdly it is a bit stupid to say that Ardupilot has range limitations. In general if you are going long range you kind of need Ardupilot to avoid that situation @Erniepointed out. Telemetry can be sent long-range to around the world using a satelite telemetry module (although it kind of costs an awful lot and the data transmission rate is slow, and telemetry via my rx/tx seems to be far faster and cheaper. Plus its very reliable) You can call it hobby grade equipment but people have done impressive stuff with this hobby grade equipment. If you can fly manually, you can just turn on manual controls and save your plane if stuff goes wrong with your Ardupilot configuration although that is likely caused due to lack of skill or caution in setup. I have flown Ardupilot enabled planes before and they have been extremely reliable with one exception - and that was my fault for trying to repair a plane that was clearly too far gone and since has been decommissioned. Now I will actually leave this post. I don't see the point in answering autopilot related questions any more in a post that I created to ask about li-ion batteries and upgrading a motor on a plane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 I din't think anyone said Ardupilot has range limitations. However, anything that transmits or receives electronically does have - like the tx, rx, fpv etc. Unless you have access to sattelites I suppose. So making such a comment is disingenuous. My concerns are that if your model is 50km away, and something goes wrong, I don't believe that you would be able to control it. And because you're BVLOS, you'd not have full view of the airspace around you even if you could. No idea what kind of flightmap you'd be filing with the authorities, but if something has gone wrong, you may well stray from it. I know commercial 'drones' do this autonomous flying, but I suspect they are using more sophisticated equipment, with layers of redundancy - you may well have redundancy, I don't know. Personally, I think it's irresponsible in the extreme to fly such machinery at such distances without insurance, but it's your risk and as you're not in the UK, me, my family and animals are safe. I'm glad you had your answers - happy flying! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fly Boy 3 Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Sorry I missed what country this poster is flying in ? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leccyflyer Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Possibly Narnia, given the fantasy posts making points such as it being okay to fly <20kg models with no insurance and relying on crappy equipment to fly many miles away BVLOS with the understanding that such is a high risk activity and you might not get the model back, without any consideration of what that actually means in practice. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Griff Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Ukraine, Russia, gazza, a war zone ??????? However, he may be completely innocent going for a civilian world record ????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murat Kece 1 Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 20 hours ago, Xeno7 said: Since for some weird reason this forum did not save that I unfollowed this post I will answer what you said quickly Firstly, Ardupilot is used commercially. It is very reliable if you set it up correctly. Secondly, @Ernie, that scenario you posted just now is rare, a bit stupid to worry about it, and I am not going to be over a motorway, the nearest motorway to my flying location is about 3km away (google maps). No insurance is needed for under 20kg - it is optional. And honestly nobody I have heard of flies with insurance (my friends). Thirdly it is a bit stupid to say that Ardupilot has range limitations. In general if you are going long range you kind of need Ardupilot to avoid that situation @Erniepointed out. Telemetry can be sent long-range to around the world using a satelite telemetry module (although it kind of costs an awful lot and the data transmission rate is slow, and telemetry via my rx/tx seems to be far faster and cheaper. Plus its very reliable) You can call it hobby grade equipment but people have done impressive stuff with this hobby grade equipment. If you can fly manually, you can just turn on manual controls and save your plane if stuff goes wrong with your Ardupilot configuration although that is likely caused due to lack of skill or caution in setup. I have flown Ardupilot enabled planes before and they have been extremely reliable with one exception - and that was my fault for trying to repair a plane that was clearly too far gone and since has been decommissioned. Now I will actually leave this post. I don't see the point in answering autopilot related questions any more in a post that I created to ask about li-ion batteries and upgrading a motor on a plane We invite you your senses my friend. It is this type of behaviour of saying I don't care I don't need insurance etc is turning the public opinion and regulators against model flying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 23 hours ago, Outrunner said: Is this legal in the UK? Almost certainly not. Any BVLOS flight would be subject to stringent regulation by the CAA and permission would be unlikely to be authorised to an individual hobbyist. Xeno - as this is primarily a UK based forum (although we welcome and enjoy contributions from members worldwide) where such operation is illegal, potentially unsafe and very much to be discouraged, there is unlikely to be much knowledge or experience of autonomous operation - hence some of the earlier confusions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Green Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 On 04/03/2024 at 14:44, Xeno7 said: well honestly you'd lose the plane no matter what if the elevator falls off unless you get very lucky with an elevator-less landing which in my opinion is likely impossible Erm.... 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leccyflyer Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 11 minutes ago, Phil Green said: Erm.... 😉 That gave me a chuckle too Phil. 😄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 An elevator-less landing isn’t impossible but is rather stressful…as I found out after flutter removed the clevis from the elevator servo of a model I was test flying for a clubmate. In fact, I did know of one full size glider pilot who managed to land from a rather traumatic winch launch without damage after failing to connect the elevator (pilot and design fault) using camber flaps to control pitch. As he was a serving cleric, there might have been an element of divine intervention! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leccyflyer Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 I'd imagine that Phil's point about the absurdity of the nonsense comment that an elevator-less landing is impossible stems from his years of flying single channel models which are not equipped with such luxuries. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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