kc Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 All the build instructions for years and years seem to say only use a contact adhesive when gluing ply doublers to fuselages. . For many years I used Thixofix which was near pefect as it would spread like peanut butter and was not critical about initial positioning of the 2 surfaces. But I have used up my stock and it seems to be unavailable now. The reason usually given for using solvent based glue rather than water based is that it does not warp the fuselage when used over a wide area. But is this really so important when we bend the fuselage to pull it in at front and rear anyway? Some version of Evostik sems to be available but its quite expensive and I remember the old Evostik as messy .. I dont fancy using spray adhesives and water based contact adhesive seems a bit pointless as I might as well use PVA. So I fancy trying PVA for the Ballerina fuselage ( fairly large area of ply and only thin 3/32 balsa ) So should I? What do other people use now? Have you used PVA and has it warped the fuselage when drying? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masher Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 I am building a Ruhig Tigre and used PVA to glue doublers to the balsa fuselage. I put a flat piece of wood plus heavy weight on top over night. All seems fine. No warping and well stuck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 I've used PVA (Wudcare 5 min super fast) but despite its name it takes a long time to go off over a big area. It wasn't a problem as regards warping. I've also used Titebond with no problems apart from the long setting time - at least overnight. I use my stock of old lead acid leakproof batteries as weights. I've always been a bit wary of contact adhesive because it's nice to have a little adjustment time, which true contact adhesives don't always offer. Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 PVA weight it down /clamp it, jobs a good un, contact adhesives make my head spin John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken anderson. Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 hello KC....pva is what i use put the bits together and weight it down(over night)....then in the morning run some cyano around the edge's to be sure all is stuck...never had any problem's... ken anderson...ne....1..... sticky dept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Barlow Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 I use aliphatic or pva depending which bottle is in my hand at the time. One thing to watch with pva though is that it does soak into the balsa quite a lot so make sure it's quite thick and the joint is fully covered with a good thickness to soak into both parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Green Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 I always sand ply to remove any mold release that may be present. White glue or contact doesn't seem to make much difference. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter S B Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Same here ken, pva and cyano. I also before pressing together put a couple of drops of cyano in the centre of both pieces, this seems to set the pva quicker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lee Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 UHU Por used as a contact adhesive works well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Jefferies Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Did you know that you can use PVA as a kind of contact adhesive.......? Brush the PVA evenly onto both pieces and allow to dry completely. Then put the two together and IRON it with a hot iron, just as you would for iron-on film though because the wood is a lot thicker than film, it takes longer for the heat to get through to the glue so you need to take it quite slowly. I would echo Percy's advice to first give the ply a light sanding to remove any remaining release agent. Try a test piece, my guess is that you will never look back! Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Miller Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 I have been using a spray on impact adhesive. since my local shop wasn't able to get Thixofix. I have been using Everbuild Stick 2 Instant spray contact adhesivr. Almst out of this and have a can of STUK Rapid Spray Glue. These two have adjustable nozzles and work really well. AS a point of interest PVA has been found still wet after a very long time between a doybler and sheet. Edited By Peter Miller on 23/12/2015 18:34:24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Miller Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 If it is between the balsa and the douber you can't see or feel the rubberyness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kc Posted December 23, 2015 Author Share Posted December 23, 2015 Thanks for all the replies. For my last few models I have used Glue Film which is sold for marquetry or furniture veneering. Applied to the ply and ironed on then the release paper is removed and both parts ironed together Works well and is similar to Paul's method in that way. But I have always worried that using heat for film covering might affect the bond. Not had any problems so far. Like contact adhesive it is an instant bond and does not hold up building whilst waiting overnight for glue to dry. The idea that there is a release agent used on ply was denied somewhere by someone in the industry but they conceded that the heat used in manufacture might have glazed the wood a bit. I cannot remember where I read that but it was likely to be a link from this forum. I suppose this glaze might stop the glue penentrating and delay setting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braddock, VC Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 30 minute Z-Poxy. Mix up a very small amount on the ply and spread it really thin; it's surprising how far it goes. Use an old credit card or similar as a squeegee. Weigh it down and you won't have to worry about delaminating. If the doublers are small eg wot 4 or acro wot, thick cyno spread thinly as above and a squirt of acceleratotor on the other piece of wood. Use the old 4 pins routine to ensure alignment. You generally have to work pdq with this method but it is extremely strong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Fisher Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Like Peter, I used to use Thixofix. Now I am using Bostik 6092 adhesive which is used by shoe repairers (and me) for the gluing on of stick on soles. It seems to become "tacky" ready for positioning of the components more quickly than other contact adhesives I have tried, but that could be inagination. Malcolm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Muir Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 I've always thought you weren't supposed to use PVA or aliphatic modified PVA's on large areas because they form a bond through solvent evaporation. If you use it on large areas the only way for the solvent to evaporate is through the wood, which, particularly with ply or dense or thick balsa, means it takes ages to dry in the middle, or never dries at all, as per Peter's post above. Letting it dry first then ironing it sounds like a good idea. Also epoxy bonds through chemical reaction so would be fine. I've only used contact adhesives up to now. It didn't occur to me that UHU Por is a contact adhesive, I might try that. John. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daren Graham - Cambria Funfighters Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 I always use cyano. You must sand the ply first though. I do sometimes use PVA beads (strips) across the surface as well but thin it 3-1 with water. You only get one shot at aligning it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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