Collapse of Thomas Cook

[Paul Marsh]

As it's aviation related, today, 23rd September Thomas Cook entered voluntary liquidation. And with it all the aircraft they fly have been impounded, starting the biggest repatriation effort since WWII.

Edited By Paul Marsh on 23/09/2019 09:51:49

[Nigel R]

It's difficult making an airline pay at the best of times. Very low profit margin (a few %) and they rely on a high volume of business.

[Don Fry]

Good riddance, the last time I used them, flying back from Jamaica, the flight stopped in Manchester, and then on to London. Another party of customers, stranded, were in Manchester, so they threw us off, cheaper to upset us, coached us eventually to London. I missed, therefore my connection to France, and paid out big money for a last minute job to get home, 24 hours late. Compensation, not our problem.

Sweetness was a few years later, case law was changed and I sued them and won. And they were slow then to pay up. Good riddance.

[Denis Watkins]

Posted by Nigel R on 23/09/2019 09:57:35:

It's difficult making an airline pay at the best of times. Very low profit margin (a few %) and they rely on a high volume of business.

True Nigel

The figures quoted for 22 million passengers was a profit of £11 for each one carried

[Mowerman]

Another big company going bust, leaving their customers, staff and suppliers in the mire, It would be interesting to see how big and healthy the 'bosses' pension funds are despite the company's losses.

[Peter Miller]

I heard on the radio this morning that the current Managing Director had been paid 5 million pounds and that the recent bosses had had 30 million between them.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Dai Fledermaus]

We to are due to fly to Kos in a few weeks time. Not a TC package deal but our flights were wth Thomas Cook. It's all in the hands of our travel agent now who are trying to find alternative flights. We can at least get a full refund if this alternative doesn't work out.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Look at the wages the higher ups paid themselves, one received £2.9m bonus from a failing company ? No need for him to sign on then.

[wingcoax]

I always thought bonuses were paid for success. Apparently they are now for turning up at the office.

[Paul Marsh]

Problem is the fat cats squeezing the company dry when its losing money. Bonuses should go on profit and not when in a loss. Mad really.I reckon over the next few years, companies of this nature will be less and less as they fall on the wayside due to inefficient business models and changing customer demand.

[kc]

Directors of companies that go bankrupt should surely have to pay back anything they have received over the Minimum Wage!

[Don Fry]

The reward package paid to the board members is commensurate with the rare skills they bring to the company, and the extreme shortage of such skills.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Yep, takes some skill to pocket a big bonus, leading a company to fail, hadn't noticed the lack of talent around though, seems to be a common event.

[kc]

Don said " The reward package paid to the board members is commensurate with the rare skills they bring to the company " .....................

Paying them the Minimum Wage seems over generous to me!

[Nigel R]

"Directors of companies that go bankrupt should surely have to pay back anything they have received over the Minimum Wage!"

Hence the invention (probably by some rather rich jolly old boys) of the public limited company, wouldn't want the creditors getting their grubby mitts on ones earnings when one's latest wheeze goes wrong.

[Jon H]

Posted by john stones 1 on 23/09/2019 12:27:07:

Look at the wages the higher ups paid themselves, one received £2.9m bonus from a failing company ? No need for him to sign on then.

Its always the way though isnt it. All these massive companies go bust and yet the big boys at the top always seem to leave with a bonus of millions of pounds. I wish i could get a million pound bonus for being totally incompetent.

[Erfolg]

A month or so back I went to Cyprus with them, it was an excellent holiday. I cannot complain.

It seems that once no one wanted to take over the business, it was pretty certain that it would go under. That is my opinion, as who would book with them in the immediate future. A cash injection would just delay the inevitable. Taking over by the government would have resulted in either the packages becoming so expensive we all would look else where, or us the taxpayer would be subsidising holidays, if we did not bags a couple of holidays for ourselves.

I can see that the devaluing of the pound would have hit the bottom line. I am not sure that issue of leaving the EU is relevant, in that it does not affect my decision to take a foreign holiday in or out of the EU.

As to management, obviously they failed to implement actions to ensure the viability of the business. The salaries and apparent bonuses appear to be a total mismatch.

Considering the employees, who cannot have sympathy, as few can survive a month without pay, without great pain. Then there is the issue of finding alternative work.

On the brighter side there will now be a hole in the market, who will fill it. Can someone fill it immediately? Or is the bigger picture other companies may be in a very similar position?

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Posted by Jon - Laser Engines on 23/09/2019 13:46:22:

Posted by john stones 1 on 23/09/2019 12:27:07:

Look at the wages the higher ups paid themselves, one received £2.9m bonus from a failing company ? No need for him to sign on then.

Its always the way though isnt it. All these massive companies go bust and yet the big boys at the top always seem to leave with a bonus of millions of pounds. I wish i could get a million pound bonus for being totally incompetent.

Yep just form another company, or get their snout in the trough elsewhere, the "little people" will have to make do and mend, how have some of these people avoided jail ?

[David P Williams]

I worked for TC for around 20 years, taking a redundancy/early retirement package in 2001. My wife and I live on TC pensions (although I have the State pension too now), so I'm a little concerned at the moment. The pension fund is well funded, and the independant trustees should protect pensions in payment, but it's all still a bit worrying.

I used to work for the Financial Services part of the company, primarily Travellers Cheques (remember them?) which was sold to Travelex around the turn of the century. The travel part of the company hardly ever made money, it was always bailed out by the income from the Travellers Cheque float - the money held from the sale of the cheques until it had to be paid out when they were cashed. As lots of cheques never got cashed, or got kept for the next holiday, and Cooks had been selling them for a very long time, this float was many millions and generated a large amount of steady income in interest. Lots of money was also made from buying and selling foreign exchange. All this was lost when this part of the company was sold.

I was transferred to the travel division and worked on the online booking website. The travel dinosaurs thought I couldn't be any use as I didn't have 20 years experience in travel. They were still focused on having the biggest high street shop chain; grudgingly accepted that they needed a call centre for phone bookings, but only tolerated Thomascook.com because the dotcom boom was still underway and they thought they could float it with an IPO and make squillions - the idiots were probably already ordering their Ferraris.

I was a pretty senior manager (in the top 40 worldwide), but an IT techie, so how could I possibly know how to run a travel company. We eventually ran out of patience with each other and I was happy to walk away with a decent deal.

It's been really sad to see them continuing with this 1980's attitude to how a travel company should operate and it's all finally caught up with them. The real culprits are not the current management, but the late 90's/early 2000's lot (I know who you are you idiots!)

[Jon H]

Posted by john stones 1 on 23/09/2019 13:54:37:

Posted by Jon - Laser Engines on 23/09/2019 13:46:22:

Posted by john stones 1 on 23/09/2019 12:27:07:

how have some of these people avoided jail ?

Probably all the money they have. Or is that a little cynical?

[Rich too]

Ironically, this is the first year that we haven't booked a holiday for next Easter as my son has exams next year. Dodged a bullet!

It is simple economics, they had debt they couldn't service.

I am getting fed up with these big companies failing, bosses walk away with millions, jobs are lost, customers let down, and pension pots depleted.

It is about time the law was changed to protect employees and consumers. Pension pots must be protected in future, and it must be made illegal to use them for finance (not saying that was the case here).

When companies are too big to fail something is clearly very wrong. and something must be done. It is becoming regular news.

So much for the global economy.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Posted by Jon - Laser Engines on 23/09/2019 13:59:22:

Posted by john stones 1 on 23/09/2019 13:54:37:

Posted by Jon - Laser Engines on 23/09/2019 13:46:22:

Posted by john stones 1 on 23/09/2019 12:27:07:

how have some of these people avoided jail ?

Probably all the money they have. Or is that a little cynical?

Not cynical enough I reckon, if they open that door, be some money to be made building more jails.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Does he Steve, or is it just noise, see he's being looked into for awarding money to "Friends" again, don't start me on bridges,water cannon or boris buses.