Martin McIntosh Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 My first Laser was a 180 I think. On the test stand and primed as per instructions I gave it a flick, not expecting it to even fire. Ouch! I could not even dare to look at my hand for a while to see if there were any fingers left on it. Never again, starter always. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 Very nice 👍 but what is all that liquid (oil?) in the bottom of the engine mount - no drain pipe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted January 27, 2023 Author Share Posted January 27, 2023 11 hours ago, Ace said: Very nice 👍 but what is all that liquid (oil?) in the bottom of the engine mount - no drain pipe? Yea dont worry about that. Its got no pushrod tubes as its a prototype so there are basically 4 oil pumps (the cam followers) pumping oil out of both sides of the crankcase. With the pushrod tubes installed that oil moves into the rocker cover and lubricates the valves instead of splattering all over the show. To address Martins point. yep, keep your digits away. Even a small 2 stroke will serve nicely as an amputation device and a big 4 stroke will just cough and spit the bits out. If you are hand starting buy a broom handle and chop a foot off one end. When you loose it, break it, or use it for kindling, chop off another foot and carry on. I dont even start my little diesels with a finger any more as i lost my rubber flicking finger thing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) Knew there would be a good reason - once pointed out I can now see there are no pushrod tube covers. 👍 Edited January 27, 2023 by Ace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin McIntosh Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 In the same vein, I was once about to start my OS 91FX which is normally a pussy cat to operate. As usual, I primed it, connected the glow and with the prop firmly grasped checked for the usual bump to confirm the prime which it did. I felt nothing but looking down saw that the end of my thumb was nearly severed off! When I was a kid I saw someone lose all of the skin from the palm of his hand. The culprit? A mere Mills 0.75. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artto Ilmanen Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 On 08/07/2020 at 12:52, Jon - Laser Engines said: To clarify again, reduction drives are at the brainstorming stage and are not going to be part of the current round of testing. Consider the engines already mentioned as the 2020 test program, reduction drives next year maybe? I have to design it yet and i am more into finishing off these engine designs first. I only asked the question as i wanted to see if there was enough interest to justify looking into them at all. Edited By Jon - Laser Engines on 08/07/2020 09:54:32 Hi Jon, Do you have any new plans on the reduction gearbox ? Is this something you might want to offer in the future or are tons of higher priorities to do first? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted February 14, 2023 Author Share Posted February 14, 2023 Reduction drive is not a priority at the moment and dead in the water. we made a test item to prove a few things, which it did just fine. But it confirmed that gears are too noisy and so it was time to move on to something else. It was fun running a 22x8 prop on a 100 though. I hope to revive the project at some point but i need support and enthusiasm from the boss for that to happen and currently i lack both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artto Ilmanen Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 17 minutes ago, Jon - Laser Engines said: Reduction drive is not a priority at the moment and dead in the water. we made a test item to prove a few things, which it did just fine. But it confirmed that gears are too noisy and so it was time to move on to something else. It was fun running a 22x8 prop on a 100 though. I hope to revive the project at some point but i need support and enthusiasm from the boss for that to happen and currently i lack both. Thanks Jon, this is clear and I think I and many others appreciate your fair reply. On the subject, I have tried to read many threads to get educated on the benefits of the reduction gear. While it's clear that a reduction gear enables using a large prop (ref. your example) which is nice with respect to scale look I still lack of understanding wether there are any true performance advantage to be gained with a reduction gear. Theoretically a larger prop can be more efficient than a smaller one but is this more theory than practice in modeler's perspective? Or could a reduction gear enable using, in certain applications, a smaller engine to produce similar performance (power) as a larger one? As you know I'v been thinking a 240v vs. a 300v Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted February 14, 2023 Author Share Posted February 14, 2023 You will always loose power through a gearbox or reduction drive due to its efficiency. You might gain some back with a more efficient prop, but i dont have data for that. The two advantages to a bigger prop are scale look, and noise. With lower rpm at the prop the tip speed is reduced and so is noise. As most of the noise of our engines is propeller noise (especially that annoying howl on large petrol engines) its worth looking into. But, not now sadly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artto Ilmanen Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 Jon, Thanks for a simple and clear answer - makes sense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul De Tourtoulon Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 Belt drive ?,,, Tony clack did one, https://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/engine-conversions-92/8269325-gas-reduction-gear-system.html electric one here , https://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/electric-pattern-aircraft-385/11669612-50-size-belt-drive.html and even one here,,,, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted February 14, 2023 Author Share Posted February 14, 2023 Yea i am hoping for a more integrated solution that looks less like someone bolted scaffolding to the engine. But, its not going to happen soon if ever by the look of it so time to move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin McIntosh Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 If I may add a bit here I would say that most Laser sales are to scale modellers who already appreciate the advantages of a reduction drive on some of the larger petrol powered models. I understand the reluctance of a factory owner to invest in a new project because he has to pay for it, but any niche in the market must be worth exploring since there must be little competition in geared 4 strokes. In the 70`s, Hanno Pretner stormed to a win with a huge Dalotel powered by 2X two stroke geared down belt driven 60`s in the Las Vegas Tournament of Champions. Nobody at the time could believe that a model of that size would perform so well with such small engines. Long ago I bought a Webra Speed geared 60. The helical gears produced much more noise than the exhaust and prop. combined so that was obviously the wrong approach at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul De Tourtoulon Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 This thread is starting to wet my appetite, only one club members Crrc 26pro to fix up and get running then I am out of a job,,,😇 Ohh, I just remembered that I have a spare clutch and main axle with different belts from my Futura, 'maybe' I could fit my old Irvine .61 marine with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artto Ilmanen Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 This is quite a neat looking one: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Walby Posted February 14, 2023 Share Posted February 14, 2023 IMHO I can't see the expense and development paying for itself for the very limited number that might be sold. Another complication and variation to the engine range that would mean more permutations to confuse the punter and tax Jon with having to give advice. Reading between the lines with changes in product range then its obvious where its heading - where the sales are and that's where it needs to be to pay its way. Can only hope we get to the radial development sooner rather than never at all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted February 20, 2023 Author Share Posted February 20, 2023 Missed your post Chris I think more will sell than certainly the boss expects as models are bigger now and people want certain things. Also if it comes from the manufacturer bolted on and ready to go then its less of a hassle to deal with than having to source it separately and bolt it all up. Also in the case of something like a 300 or 360v i might abandon the straight shaft version and only offer the reduction drive version as most models using one of those engines would probably want a reduction anyway. As for range expansion..ugh. I can think of at least 20 engines right now that we should offer but dont. These would be in addition to the current range and many would be much bigger engines for the most part. The problems are the same as always. Insufficient resource, vison, and enthusiasm from the management. For example, i have a plan to make the 360v bigger and turn it into a 425. I need 4 components to do this (long term only 3) but no, i am told its not worth it as the 360 dosent sell enough. Perhaps because we never make any? Not 100% sure but it could be a factor. Not that it matters. I plan to make a prototype myself at home when i get the chance. Test the performance and plonk it on the desk. Hopefully with a list of folk who want to buy them! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artto Ilmanen Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 On 18/01/2023 at 13:26, Jon - Laser Engines said: The first FT-310 prototype was fired up just now and the performance was slightly above my expectation. I wanted 8000 on an APC 20x8 but the little beasty gave me 8200 peak and 8000/8100 steady. No video im afraid as i nearly lost a finger to hypothermia in the propeller slipstream and had to not only cut short my run plan for the 310 but abandon my plans to catch up on engine running until we get a bit more warmth. Anyway, things are starting to move. This is interesting! Is the FT310 bolt pattern going to be the same with the 300V? I don’t recall the rpm of my 300V with a 20x8 so I wonder if the FT310 falls somewhere between the 300V and 360V in terms of power & ability to turn large props? How is the weight of the FT310? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted February 20, 2023 Author Share Posted February 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Artto Ilmanen said: Is the FT310 bolt pattern going to be the same with the 300V? I don’t recall the rpm of my 300V with a 20x8 so I wonder if the FT310 falls somewhere between the 300V and 360V in terms of power & ability to turn large props? How is the weight of the FT310? Same mounting pattern Approx 7800rpm on a 300v with an APC 20x8 so 300-400 rpm faster on that prop. Not tested others back to back yet. Not sure about the weight as its not finished yet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artto Ilmanen Posted February 20, 2023 Share Posted February 20, 2023 thanks, Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted March 29, 2023 Author Share Posted March 29, 2023 The first batch of FT310's will be heading out the door in the coming days. More to follow in a few weeks once the pinion drives and conrods are done so if you didnt get a call yet dont panic, more are coming. I referenced this before but conversations with a number of customers today has reminded me. 70cc twin, flat or V, maybe both...not important right now. But a 70cc twin of whatever configuration running on low oil glow for bigger models than our current 360 can handle. Simple yes or no on the above spec please chaps. Dont need war and peace of alternative suggestions, just a simple yes or no on that base spec. who is interested? 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerotec Posted March 29, 2023 Share Posted March 29, 2023 Oh they look really very nice! Lucky folk getting one of those beasts! Hope you don't mind me copying the picture over to the Facebook "Laser Engine Owners" group? 70cc...yes please!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maurice northcott Posted March 29, 2023 Share Posted March 29, 2023 Jon, re the proposed 70cc twin - preferably flat for me - yes please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike skingle Posted March 29, 2023 Share Posted March 29, 2023 (edited) Yes I would like a 70cc Vtwin. Please Edited March 29, 2023 by mike skingle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyGnome Posted March 30, 2023 Share Posted March 30, 2023 Definitely things of beauty! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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