Caught by HMRC import duty

[Spice Cat]

Apologies if this has been crossed before but may serve as a reminder.

In December 2014 I ordered a set of Fat Shark FPV goggles and bits from the Hong Kong side of Hobbyking. I opted for delivery by DHL Express and they performed very well delivering in less than a week.

Today I received a letter from DHL Express demanding VAT and duty payment of the amount of £71.22 within seven days as I had not paid the bill from their original invoice sent on the 31st of December 2014.

This represents VAT of the order amount of £316 and an £8 administration fee.

Needless to say this was the first I knew of this and it was a bit of a shock to say the least. At first I thought it was a scam as there was a warning on the DHL website and there were a number of errors on the letter.

Having contacted DHL I found this was not the case and indeed I did owe them £71.22. No mention of this was made at the time of the delivery and should it have been I would have been inclined to refuse and shoulder the re postage payment. The letter stated payment must be made within seven days or the matter would be passed to a debt collecting agency.

I have requested a stay on this timeframe to request clarification from Hobbyking. I know the likely outcome of this and don't think I will be ordering this amount of goods again. It's probably my own fault as I did consult the HMRC website that said all duties will be paid before the goods are released by HMRC

What annoys me the most is that the time between delivery and invoice was an extended length of time allowing me to thoroughly play with my new purchase and render in unsuitable to return.

Be warned though. In the mean time I am off to the bank of matrimony to prepare payment.

[Ultymate]

TNT operate the same system ie deliver first then send a bill for the excise duty handling charge and VAT on the lot. Parcelforce hold your goods until the requisite duty is paid and then deliver

[Area 51]

Howdy Spice, when importing there will be a duty payable and VAT on top of most products! I think if DHL held all items they collected duty and VAT on, they would fill a warehouse fairly quickly.. However, I suspect if you refuse payment this time they will pursue to collect and future deliveries through them are held for duty/VAT payment before the item is sent out too you.

Royal Mail do a similar thing for incoming post from around the world when a value has been declared. FEDEX do the same too; I just settled one with them this week - although my goods were delivered two weeks ago without any notification of duty payable.

The only way to dodge is for an invoice accompanying the shipment coming into the UK to show a low value... this will reduce the duty/VAT.. however the shipper will be breaking the law and any claim for losses will be based on the declared value..

[will -0]

So you imported something that was liable for VAT and now you're complaining at having to pay VAT?

[will -0]

The only way to dodge is for an invoice accompanying the shipment coming into the UK to show a low value... this will reduce the duty/VAT.. however the shipper will be breaking the law and any claim for losses will be based on the declared value..

I;m sure this used to be called "smuggling".

[Area 51]

Posted by will -0 on 06/02/2015 15:01:53:

I;m sure this used to be called "smuggling".

I would love too know the term for DHL charging so much for collecting duty!!??.. nice little earner...

[will -0]

Posted by Area 51 on 06/02/2015 15:06:36:

Posted by will -0 on 06/02/2015 15:01:53:

I;m sure this used to be called "smuggling".

I would love too know the term for DHL charging so much for collecting duty!!??.. nice little earner...

It's called "business"

If you work out the overheaded hourly rate of the administration of this plus associated costs and a bit of profit (it's a business, remember), £8 sounds quite reasonable to me.

[chris Bond - Bondaero]

It is entirely to be expected that you will pay vat on imports from outside of the EU. If you do not get charged then you have been lucky. There are now, fewer and fewer packages that escape the charges. The moral is really to buy from the UK or actually Europe with the euro on its knees.

[Spice Cat]

Mixed bag here. Yes I admit to have falling for not having paid in the past so my fault. The only compensation I have is that they are a cracking pair of goggles and I will use them for all they are worth. Yes, nice little earner for DHL. I'm sure they will make something from it however.

I agree, either EU or UK from now on unless its a very small amount or not available in the UK.

Whatever happens, lets keep it light.

[iqon]

Nothing new, you will still have saved money on the equivalent over here, only £8.00 handling charge, sure with royal mail you pay £10 for the privilege

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Chin up S.C, weathers not bad so if you've owt left when bills paid put some juice in car n get off flying

John

[Tomtom39]

I didn't have an issue paying VAT. Mine was a £130 order (for item not available in the UK/Eu warehouse )but what stuck in my throat was the £13.50 admin charge by Parcel force plus £5.50 for storage (it would appear that they sent me a letter - which I never got and then sent me a reminder 14 days later!). Expensive lesson learned.

[Spice Cat]

Posted by john stones 1 on 06/02/2015 15:52:05:

Chin up S.C, weathers not bad so if you've owt left when bills paid put some juice in car n get off flying

John

Sounds good

[Engine Doctor]

Yes anything over £15 including the postage and you get clobbered . Perhaps if we stopped using HK other than the UK and complain if the item is not in stock they might pull their finger out and stock up properly.A few times in the past Iv'e ordered parcels from HobbyKings global WH and from china for much more money and they have come through duty free. Guess I was just lucky

[Area 51]

Posted by will -0 on 06/02/2015 15:25:08:

Posted by Area 51 on 06/02/2015 15:06:36:

Posted by will -0 on 06/02/2015 15:01:53:

I would love too know the term for DHL charging so much for collecting duty!!??.. nice little earner...

It's called "business"

If you work out the overheaded hourly rate of the administration of this plus associated costs and a bit of profit (it's a business, remember), £8 sounds quite reasonable to me.

The overhead?

Youre having a laugh, and not in business I dare say.

I get telephone text messages from DHL when my parcel is collected at point of origin.... this lets me know the shipment (from overseas) is moving and then what my duty payments are...

This all commences once the airwaybill number is activated by collection; the voice message is automated.. the most work then required is me logging on to the DHL epayment website to make a payment..

They charge £8 for this... come on, its all IT driven and very low cost...

I wonder once they have collected the duty from us how long they wait before handing over to the exchequer?

[Area 51]

Posted by Tomtom39 on 06/02/2015 16:02:19:

I didn't have an issue paying VAT. Mine was a £130 order (for item not available in the UK/Eu warehouse )but what stuck in my throat was the £13.50 admin charge by Parcel force plus £5.50 for storage (it would appear that they sent me a letter - which I never got and then sent me a reminder 14 days later!). Expensive lesson learned.

Nice little earner indeed...

Fedex charged me £12.50 this week as a fee for collecting HMRC costs... so just from the variation in costs for collecting the taxes... we can see who is taking the proverbial here!

[Malcolm Fisher]

This isn't a new situation. I fell foul of the import duty requirements many years ago when I sent a Flight Link transmitter for repair. It transpired that the company had moved to one of the Channel Islands and I was charged import duty on the cost of the repair even though the radio had originally been bought in the UK when it was posted back to me. I had to pay the duty before I could receive the package.

Malcolm

[John Privett]

Posted by will -0 on 06/02/2015 15:25:08

If you work out the overheaded hourly rate of the administration of this plus associated costs and a bit of profit (it's a business, remember), £8 sounds quite reasonable to me.

Compared to others, that's cheap. The one time I was charged on an imported package, Parcelforce slapped their £14 admin charge on top of a £7 tax bill, meaning I paid £21 in order to pay £7 tax.

[John Privett]

Posted by Spice Cat on 06/02/2015 14:45:32:

Having contacted DHL I found this was not the case and indeed I did owe them £71.22. No mention of this was made at the time of the delivery and should it have been I would have been inclined to refuse and shoulder the re postage payment.

Is that actually an option?

Can you 'unimport' something after HMRC have decided you owe them tax on it? (Or would they think you were just going to try and import it again later and hope to get through?)

And if you did return the goods to HK purely on the grounds that you didn't want to pay the tax, would they refund you? The Distance Selling Regulations don't apply here!

[Geoff S]

I seem to have been lucky so far with parcels from HK and I also bought some Hangar 9 spares from a US supplier (not available here) without paying duty or VAT. I had a V912 brushless helicopter delivered just after Christmas form Banggood in HK duty free.

With the amount of consumer goods being imported by individuals (as opposed to companies) I'm surprised HMRC have been so relaxed about claiming the due tax and duty. I wouldn't say I'm happy to pay the taxes but I don't mind too much because it represents unfair competition for UK businesses who can't get away without paying. I think the £8 charge is reasonable. I had to pay at least £10 some years ago for a RealFlight simulator I bought from the US. It ended up very little cheaper than buying it here.

My BnF brushless V912 cost less than £40 for the airframe alone inc postage! They're much more expensive if bought from a UK supplier.

Geoff

[Pete B]

I think it's all part of a Europe-wide tightening-up of import duty collection, for the Douaniers seem to be getting a bit more vigilant here, too. The internet has made overseas purchasing no more difficult than purchasing a product in your home country and with the EU governments looking to harvest every bit of income, it's obvious that by checking a higher percentage of incoming packets, they'll reap more duty.

I recall reading something to that effect from HMRC about the time the limit dropped from £18 to £15.

Fortunately the handling charges are a bit lower here

I don't think it's realistic to expect them to reach a stage where every incoming packet is checked - the manpower/revenue balance has to be met - so I think we have to accept that if it comes through without charges, we should consider that a bonus.

Pete

[Phil Green]

A friend in America made a batch of my reeds emulation encoders for his pals. He asked if I would like a few of the bare PCBs he'd made, which I gratefully accepted as I hate making pcbs. Now this was truly a gift, no money was involved, he'd made them himself, not bought them, and they had zero monetary value. The parcel was labelled as such - value, zero. Gift.

It seems that HMRC opened the package and decided for themselves what these home-made bare pcb boards were worth and charged me £27 which I had to pay before delivery. In fact I had to pay before I even knew what the package was.

Maybe marking a customs declaration as a gift makes it more likely to be intercepted, I dont know, but the excise duty was much more than the practical value of the boards.

It seems that HMRC have the final word and theres nothing you can do about it!

Cheers
Phil

[Erfolg]

I can comprehend the VAT at about £3 and the handling charge of approx. £8, but where does the other circa £60 come from?

I was caught for something like 10p over £15, yet the additional charges of about £12 was still much lower cost than a UK purchase (if the actual item was available).

It can still make sense to be your own importer. The distributors would have added far more.

[John Privett]

Posted by Erfolg on 06/02/2015 22:36:32:

I can comprehend the VAT at about £3 and the handling charge of approx. £8, but where does the other circa £60 come from?

Eh? As you haven't quoted anything I can only guess that you're querying SpiceCat's original post...

If so, then the info is all there in the original post;

"...demanding VAT and duty payment of the amount of £71.22 within seven days as I had not paid the bill from their original invoice sent on the 31st of December 2014.

This represents VAT of the order amount of £316 and an £8 administration fee."

20% VAT on £316 is £63.20. Add the £8 admin charge and it comes to £71.20. Which is close enough to SC's figure of £71.22 for me - unless you're bothered about the extra tuppence!

[Max50]

I ordered a guitar from America a few years back and was expecting the import duty before they delivered it. As you, i was quite happy when i received it with no other payement and couldn't understand why, but then came down to earth when i received the duty bill ( over £100 ) a few weeks later. But i was expecting to pay when i ordered it , so no shock, just couldn't understand at first ,why i received it with no duty payement.