Please help me. I'm seventy-five next month and I'm being left behind.

[David Davis]

Good day gentlemen!

 

Once upon a time, when I first started flying r/c, in the late Nineteen Eighties, there were perhaps four manufacturers of radio equipment which were widely seen on British flying fields: Futaba, JR/MacGregor, Hitec and Sanwa. There were a couple of British makes but they soon faded away. I started with a second hand but unused Sanwa. None of these radios contained computers so there were no model memories. If you had more than one model you reversed the settings on transmitter as necessary so that all of the control surfaces moved in the correct way when you moved the sticks.

 

Then I purchased a Futaba FF6. This was still an FM radio but it had a computer inside it with, was it six model memories? A mate of mine described it as  "A helluva thing!" I kept that radio for many years until a wire broke at the base of the aerial and the model, a Super 60 I was instructing on, went free flight. 

 

I then went digital and bought a Spektrum Dx6i transmitter and receiver. This had ten model memories. I had to send the DX6i back to the agent when the rudder trim switch failed but that was quickly replaced free of charge. Since then this transmitter has proved to be eminently reliable as did the Futaba and Sanwa transmitters which I'd previously used.

 

Then I bought a Spektrum DX9 which has had to be sent back to the agent three times in the eight years I've owned it but I'd kept the DX6i so I was able to fly my models using that transmitter. Please note, I am not Spektrum bashing, merely relating my experience with my DX9. Fully 33% of my club use Spektrum equipment with no reliability problems whatsoever and they certainly seem to be easier to programme than the modern Futaba transmitter, the most popular make of radio in my club. Several members use both makes, another member uses old Multiplex radios and the best pilot in the club uses a Taranis. Perhaps significantly he's a computer programmer.

 

So that's the background now to the meat of the matter. I will declare from the outset that I am a computer-phobe. Even downloading and printing my bank statements is a problem for me. Sorry, that should be "challenge!" I am toying with the idea of buying a Radiomaster transmitter because I like the red and black appearence, the technical specs are way over my head, but I'm put off by the "steep learning curve" which I'll need to overcome in order to get the transmitter working correctly so I have the following questions for those more knowledgable than me.

 

1. What is an Open Source Operating System and how does it differ from the Spektrum operating system if indeed there is a difference?

2. What is the difference between the Edge Tx and the Open TX and what advantages does the Edge TX have over the Open Tx?

3. How would you describe telemetry and what use is it?

4. What is functionality?

5. Are FrSky and Taranis the same thing?

6. The FrSky/Taranis  has been described as "more capable and flexible" in these pages. In what way is it more capable and flexible?

 

If it's of any importance I fly a wide range of mostly i/c powered sports and scale models, I have custody of one of the club's ARTF trainers and a couple of vintage models which I use as basic trainers with retired beginners.

 

Thank you for your indulgence.

 

 

 

 

[J D 8]

   Hi David, Thing is the younger have taken to this sort of stuff like ducks to water, they have grown up with it.

      Its the same with motor mechanics. Today you have to know the ins and outs of what the computer reader tells you where as folks our generation would diagnose a motor problem with eye, ear, nose and finger.

   Like you I had an FF6 and found having the memory great. Before I would try and set up models the same like having servos all moving the same way [ no reversing needed to fly another model ]

  Today I use a Futaba T8j that does what I need flying sports and scale types.

  One thing that used to irritate me was at one time we had a young club expert who was good at instructing and he would be using one of the high end computer [pre open source] Problem was he would recommend similar sets for older members to purchase which they did. Trouble then was those members would struggle to get to grips with their sets and their model programs.  He could could of course sort them in no time as long as he was there.  

   Just my thoughts,  John.

[David Davis]

I know what you mean John. Younger people are amazed when I tell them that we had to use fountain pens rather than ballpoint pens when I was at secondary school because ballpoint pens allegedly ruined your handwriting. There was an inkwell on every desk. No laptops or tablets then!

[kc]

You don't know how easy you have had it.............fountain pens were for wimps!   Real schoolchildren used 'dip' pens which you dipped into the ink wells which were filled from big cans of blackish liquid!

 

But seriously David has asked the right questions - no answers yet?    My view is that anything that can be updated online or changed in some way will be just the same as updating your computer - something unexpected will happen just when you don't need it.   So why  do it?   Let the youngsters experiment and I will stick with a good old fashioned Tx!     Futaba 6EX and Spektrum DX6i  ( DSMX only ) for me.

 

P.S. only Smart Alecs (nerds) had the new fangled cartridge filled fountain pens not the proper fountain pens you filled by sucking the ink in from a bottle of ink carried in ones satchel - messy!

Edited February 23, 2023 by kc

[J D 8]

       I am a tad younger than you David but in my primary school once you were past the crayon stage one was expected to get to grips with pen and ink, filling the wells was a designated job for a pupil each morning.

[Nigel R]

Not much time, but can provide some quick answers

 

2 hours ago, David Davis said:

1. What is an Open Source Operating System and how does it differ from the Spektrum operating system if indeed there is a difference?

2. What is the difference between the Edge Tx and the Open TX and what advantages does the Edge TX have over the Open Tx?

3. How would you describe telemetry and what use is it?

4. What is functionality?

5. Are FrSky and Taranis the same thing?

6. The FrSky/Taranis  has been described as "more capable and flexible" in these pages. In what way is it more capable and flexible?

 

1. Open source = written by unpaid enthusiasts, available for anyone to use. Spektrum paid people to write their software, only spektrum use it.

2. No idea, sorry... I'm a happy Spektrum owner.

3. Telemetry = model sends data back to TX. E.g. RX battery voltage. You can display it on the TX, or set alarms (e.g. for low RX volts). Other data might include vario (height) for instance.

4. Functionality = "the stuff what the thing does".

5. FrSky = brand. Taranis = product.

6. Hmm... If you have yet to find something the DX9 does not do, you will not notice the "more capable and flexible" of the Taranis or Radiomaster.

 

hope that helps somewhat.

[Cuban8]

If you've managed with setting up a Spektrum outfit then stick with them.

[Ron Gray]

2 hours ago, David Davis said:

1. What is an Open Source Operating System and how does it differ from the Spektrum operating system if indeed there is a difference?

2. What is the difference between the Edge Tx and the Open TX and what advantages does the Edge TX have over the Open Tx?

3. How would you describe telemetry and what use is it?

4. What is functionality?

5. Are FrSky and Taranis the same thing?

6. The FrSky/Taranis  has been described as "more capable and flexible" in these pages. In what way is it more capable and flexible?

In directly trying to answer your various questions:

 

1. Open Source means that it is freely available to be used by anyone and is developed by enthusiasts. As such it tends to be more flexible as it isn’t designed for one make of hardware. Different to Spektrum, well yes due to my previous comments. Will it do the same, well yes and probably a lot more too!

2. Simply put Edge Tx is a more up to date, improved version of Open Tx and is where most development is taking place.

3. Telemetry is the system whereby your Tx can receive information such as amount of battery used (whilst you are flying), signal strength (warnings when low) plus a lot, lot more.

4. Functionality usually describes the amount of additional things the Tx / operating system can do, such as multiple switches, rotary knobs, touch screens, telemetry feedback etc.

5. FrSky manufacturer the Taranis range of Tx along with several others.

6. Not sure that the Taranis is more capable and flexible as that tends to be a result of its operating system, Open Tx.

 

Please note that the above is a very simplified set of answers to give you a better understanding.

 

 

oops,  Nigel beat me to it!

Edited February 23, 2023 by Ron Gray

[kc]

The people who crash least have a saying  - " if it ain't broke don't fix it"

[Colin Carpenter]

As a contented owner of a faultless 14 year old DX9 I watch the couple of folks using Radiomaster Tx fiddle for ages to set up and have concluded I can’t live long enough to bother to change systems. The DX9 does everything I need for planes/choppers. It’s run  for nearly 11 day’s operating time for models flying. The youngster who flys quads in my chopper club has just upgraded his Radiomaster after only a couple of years ! I don’t expect any of this helps David 😂😂😂😂! Colin 

[Ron Gray]

2 hours ago, David Davis said:

but I'm put off by the "steep learning curve" which I'll need to overcome in order to get the transmitter working correctly

Don’t be! It does not have to be a steep learning curve and a simple model can be setup using ‘model wizards’ which lead you through the setup. Sure, more ‘advanced’ settings can be a struggle to deal with but like everything once you know where they are it becomes easy. One of the easiest ways to setup a new model is to copy a previous one!

[Ron Gray]

4 minutes ago, Colin Carpenter said:

I watch the couple of folks using Radiomaster Tx fiddle for ages to set up

By the same token I watch several fliers in my club just switch them on and fly! I have also seen 2 new club members struggle with changing settings on their Spektrum TXs!

 

The point is that these type of comments are indicative of the individuals understanding not a reflection on the hardware they are trying to operate!

[Graham Bowers]

1. What is an Open Source Operating System and how does it differ from the Spektrum operating system if indeed there is a difference?

 

Open source is a computer programming term. Computer programs** are written in a man readable form however computers need programs in a binary form. The man-readable form is called "source code" and the binary "machine code". For commercial software, the source code is a carefully protected piece of intellectual property, and what you buy is machine code. ** I know about assembler and low level machine code programming, just trying to keep in simple 😉

 

However, "open source" has become synonymous with operating systems that have a high degree of flexibility. Although the Multiplex MC4000 and it's predecessors could do all of that in the 1990's.

 

Open source means the source code is available to all, to read or modify as they see fit. When a piece of open source software is modified and called it's own name, the new version is "forked"

 

The spekky operating system is closed source, i.e. a secret,

 

 

2. What is the difference between the Edge Tx and the Open TX and what advantages does the Edge TX have over the Open Tx?

 

OpenTx (OTX) came before EdgeTx (ETX). The ETX team took OTX, modified it and called the modified version EdgeTx. So ETX is a fork of OTX. They do the same job however ETX supports touch screen inputs, which makes it easier to do things.

 

My radiomaster came with ETX but I put OTX on it. I chose to stay with what I know, for now. Reasons given by others to favour ETX over OTX centre around the touch screen capability, and more rapid responses to bug fixes / requests to change. My view is that if such rapid responses are needed, something is wrong with it.

 

3. How would you describe telemetry and what use is it?

With 2.4 GHz systems, the Tx and Rx talk to each other. So the Rx transmits back to the Tx in order to sort out which channel is going to be used  next, for example.  35MHZ  for example, where the signal was pushed out and the receiver did only that, receive. So if the capability exists for teh receiver to talk back to the transmitter exists, why not use that link to send useful data back to the TX? That's what telemetry is. The data from the model can be sent back to the Tx and made useful. For example, on an IC model, I just set it up to send back the battery voltage. However it also sends back the received signal strength, so if the model is getting a bit far away, or my body is between the Tx antenna and the model (as is possible if flying FPV through goggles) the transmitter knows. The transmitter can be set up to do various things with the data. For electric models I have a current sensor, so i can get motor amps. With the motor voltage, i can set up an alarm on the Tx to tell me whenit gets down to whatever value I wish. There are other sensors but I only use voltage and current.

 

4. What is functionality?

It's a posh word for saying how capable, or how many things something can do. In the context of the Taranis or radiomaster, I'll just use mixers as an example. You can create a mixer on the Tx for a channel, for example elevator. You then choose what inputs there are and their weighting. An example is a little EDF model I just got. It zoomed up on high throttle, and of course, you can't just put a couple of washers in for downthrust. So I told teh elevator mix to put a bit of down in when the throttle was opened up. But as I needed more down elevator at higher throttle openings, I created a curve (a non linear relationship between throttle stick position and elevator deflection). You could mix in anything you wanted, battery voltage if you wished, to compensate for reducing voltage. i'm not saying you should, just demonstrating the functionality is limited only by imagination.

 

In the kitchen, one may have a knife to cut veg. Or a food processer to cut / dice / liquidise, beat etc etc. The food processor has more functionality than the knife.

 

 

5. Are FrSky and Taranis the same thing?

FrSky is the company. Taranis is a transmitter, although there are a range of transmitters beariig the Taranis name. FrSky makes other transmitters with different names too.

 

 

6. The FrSky/Taranis  has been described as "more capable and flexible" in these pages. In what way is it more capable and flexible?

Hopefully the mix example above helps. I also do things like send telemetry data back to the transmitter to be stored on an SD card. It can just do more. Take timers as an example. I can set up a countdown timer and make it give me whatever verbal messages I want, at any yime during the countdown. And I can create my own sound files and play them. So, lets's take call commands for aerobatics. It can be set up so at the flick of a switch, it's say the next command in a pre-determined sequence. (I want to do that, but haven't yet).

 

Hope this helps. I'm 66 😉

 

 

 

[Don Fry]

I’m in the same boat as David. I have a DX9, very early model, reliable in my case. I’m thinking of replacement.

Choice for me, a Radiomaster, or another Spectrum transmitter, similar to the DX9, perhaps an extra channel. 

I am not computer illiterate, but it’s a process for me, not a hobby. And on my own, no backup, Ytube is my friend, yawn.

Or buy a Spectrum replacement.

 

Radiomaster with decent sticks is a couple of hundred quid cheaper. Cost up what I value time at, not sure I could be bothered.

Not a decision yet, because no argument the Radiomaster has more functionality, as it is more flexible to set up due to the mix anything with anything concept. But as an example I don’t think I would ever want rudder to gear doors mixing, with a side salad of landing lights when the gear doors reach 43 % open. 
 

Starting out, no contest, Radiomaster, but I’m not starting out. I am comfortable with Spectrum.

 

Decisions, decisions.

[Graham Bowers]

Something not mentioned yet in this thread is the radiomaster T16S is multi protocol (will talk to many brands of receiver) (or can be supplied with an ELRS module for those at the cutting edge) . So far I've bound mine with a spekky bind+fly Mobula6 quadcomter, some of my Taranis receivers and some of my Multiplex receivers. So the old exit barrier from a 2.4 GHz manufacturer where only their receivers and transmitters work together no longer exists.

Edited February 23, 2023 by Graham Bowers
To clarify, hopefully

[Allan Bennett]

3 hours ago, David Davis said:

Please help me. I'm seventy-five next month and I'm being left behind . . .

 

When I was about your age (😁) I was the very sasified owner of a high-end Futaba transmitter, with the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' attitude to things electrical.  But then I set up motor diffential on my Multiplex Twinstar to aid ground handling, but couldn't figure out a way to program the Futaba's throttle-cut switch to act on both throttle channels.  Someone on this forum suggested that FrSky Taranis with OpenTX could do it, and they were right!  I quickly converted all my models to FrSky and sold all my Futaba FASST receivers for more than the cost of the replacement FrSky ones.

 

For me the beauty of OpenTX is its flexibility;  I can program any stick or switch to do anything, and I can also program them to tell me what they're doing.  I don't even try to do any programming in the field, rather doing it via the computer interface at home.

[Peter Christy]

Well, I've just turned 73, so I'm not far behind you! I've been flying powered models since 1962 (control-line) and progressed to RC in 1965. Most of my working life was in what I guess would be considered "hi-tech" (the engineering side of broadcast TV), so I've never really had any issues with advancing technology.

 

A few answers to some of your questions:

"Open Source" - most modern transmitters are computer based. The chips are relatively cheap and offer a lot of potential over older "discrete" designs. Like any computer, the chips need an operating system of some kind in order to function. Most of the older manufacturers use their own proprietary operating systems (think Windows on your PC), but newer manufacturers have opted for newer operating systems which are designed by modellers with the requisite skills, rather than contractors hired for the job. In other words, the operating system is designed by modellers in much the same way that the aircraft we fly are.

 

Unlike proprietary systems, these modellers publish the "source code" of the operating system - the building instructions, if you like - so that others in the community can examine, modify and bug-hunt the code. Any modifications can be submitted back to the design team to be checked and included in updated releases.

 

Because the source code is open to public scrutiny, it is generally referred to as "Open Source". A similar system exists in the computer world, in the form of Linux. The PC I'm typing this on is running Linux - not Windows!

 

At a basic level (think 3 or 4 function trainer) there is little to choose between proprietary and open source. Open source is generally more flexible - especially on cheaper transmitters - for example, if a throttle cut switch is on the "wrong" side of the transmitter from your personal perspective.

 

Open source really comes into its own on complex setups, where you might be trying to do something the proprietary designers didn't think of! If the proprietary system doesn't want to let you do something you are stuck! With open source systems, there is nearly always a work-around!

 

EdgeTx Vs OpenTx: Under the hood, they are essentially the same! EdgeTx is a "fork" of OpenTx (Ah! The beauty of open source!)

 

The EdgeTx team felt that OpenTx was lagging a bit behind on some features on recent transmitters (think touch-screens). They also felt that OpenTx wasn't as user friendly as it might be, so they took the OpenTx source code and modified it to produce EdgeTx, which now supports touch-screens and has a more friendly interface.

Personally, I never had an issue with OpenTx, but I have been working around computers since the early 1970s, so perhaps I have an advantage here! Having said that, a number of my clubmates use OpenTx/EdgeTx, and whilst it can be a steep learning curve to master the more complex functions available, at a basic level it is no more complex than any other computerised transmitter system.

 

Open/EdgeTx doesn't come with a handy instruction booklet, but there are plenty of guides, instructions, "how-to's" and video guides available on the internet. There are lots of Open/EdgeTx users here willing to answer questions, too!

 

Telemetry: We managed for decades without it, but now many regard it as indispensable! Basically it allows the receiver in the aircraft to return information to the transmitter, where it can be used to either display information or sound an alarm. Probably the two most useful sensors (present in nearly all telemetry receivers) are the receiver battery voltage and signal strength. These can display on the transmitter screen and be programmed to sound an alarm if either falls below a pre-determined level. You can also get variometers to tell whether your glider is going up or down - useful for thermal soaring!

 

Frsky is a brand name. Taranis is one of their more popular transmitters (think Ford (FrSky) Fiesta (Taranis)).

The flexibility is primarily a function of the operating system - OpenTx or EdgeTx (see above). The major proprietary manufacturers have started to wake up and now offer some of the extra functionality the OpenTx offers - the first example being to be able to program auxiliary switch/levers to your desired function rather than theirs, but most still lag way behind on more advanced features (multiple mixes on glider wings, for example). Whether this is of any importance to you personally is something only you can decide.

 

One other thing that you didn't mention, but many see as important, is the 4-in-1 modules offered either built-in (RadioMaster, etc) or as a plug-in option (Frsky). These modules offer most of the RF protocols used by many manufacturers (Spektrum, Multiplex, some Futaba, some Frsky, plus many more), and can be programmed directly from Open/EdgeTx and stored with the model memory. This means that with such a transmitter, you can fly almost any receiver you choose, as opposed to - say - Spektrum, where you are restricted to Spektrum receivers only.

 

Basic FrSky receivers - for example - are a LOT cheaper than many of the big brand name alternatives, and perform at least as well. I've been using FrSky almost since they first appeared, and they have proven every bit as reliable as my JR receivers that preceded them. If you intend to buy a few receivers, this is definitely something to bear in mind.

Hope that gives you some help in coming to a decision!

 

Whilst I've been typing this epic, I see some others have beaten me to it with some of these points, but never mind! They bear repeating!

 

--
Pete

[kc]

Graham& Peter,  two good explanations  - needs an article like that in RCME.    Needed I  think because many people come back into the hobby and will need just that sort of explanation.

 

But to 'cut to the chase'   the real answer to Davids question is contained in last weeks thread " Armchair Detective Needed"  where the telemetry from a crash was given and discussed by all the Modelflying usual experts  and the conclusion ( if any! ) was that some update to the Tx may or may not have been done and possibly caused the crash!  Telemetry didn't prevent the crash but an update (not done?) may have caused it!  

 

If someone thinks this is like the Luddites then I would point out that recent thinking about AI seems to suggest the Luddites were on the right track! 

Edited February 23, 2023 by kc

[dave parnham]

Dont know if its allowed to share this video but id say stick with what you know and maybe upgrade to the NX10 or i think there is a NX14 they seem simple enough.

Having been Futaba all the way and sometimes struggle with my 18 with flaps and curves, i see this as your best route.

Surely a decent model shop can demo one for you over the counter?

[MattyB]

4 hours ago, David Davis said:

Then I bought a Spektrum DX9 which has had to be sent back to the agent three times in the eight years I've owned it but I'd kept the DX6i so I was able to fly my models using that transmitter. Please note, I am not Spektrum bashing, merely relating my experience with my DX9. Fully 33% of my club use Spektrum equipment with no reliability problems whatsoever and they certainly seem to be easier to programme than the modern Futaba transmitter, the most popular make of radio in my club. Several members use both makes, another member uses old Multiplex radios and the best pilot in the club uses a Taranis. Perhaps significantly he's a computer programmer.

 

So that's the background now to the meat of the matter. I will declare from the outset that I am a computer-phobe. Even downloading and printing my bank statements is a problem for me. Sorry, that should be "challenge!" I am toying with the idea of buying a Radiomaster transmitter because I like the red and black appearence, the technical specs are way over my head, but I'm put off by the "steep learning curve" which I'll need to overcome in order to get the transmitter working correctly

 

Others have ably answered your questions, so I won't bother with those. However, I will give give you an opinion based on the text highlighted above, and I say this as a 10+ year user and huge advocate of the open source systems... In your case, stick with Spektrum.

 

Why? Because whilst the open source systems are not fundamentally more difficult to use, they are very different in concept. They use what is known as an object oriented approach which is quite different to the "canned mixer" style of most of the big brand manufacturers. This diagram (from this excellent site)...

 

 

...and this video explain it well...

 

 

 

The problem comes when a pilot new to the open source systems tries to approach things from the angle of "How would I do this in my old Futaba/JR/Spektrum?"  - the menus and names for things dont look the same, and they eventually give up because they can't bring themselves to give up their previous ways of thinking*. This tends to be more prevalent amongst older pilots (not always, but in general) because we all naturally find it harder to let go of knowledge and take a new approach as we age. Given your statement in bold above, I think this is likely (though not certain) to apply to yourself, so sticking with the more traditional approach used by Spektrum will probably be easiest and most enjoyable for you, though it will cost more.

 

* - This is probably why the open source TXs have been so popular with complete newcomers to the hobby - they are cheap and feature rich, and newcomers don't have to "forget" how they did something like a v-tail mix on their old TX in order to get it to work.

 

Edited February 23, 2023 by MattyB

[Nigel R]

27 minutes ago, kc said:

was that some update to the Tx may or may not have been done and possibly caused the crash!

 

I don't think that was the conclusion.

 

40 minutes ago, Peter Christy said:

This means that with such a transmitter, you can fly almost any receiver you choose, as opposed to - say - Spektrum, where you are restricted to Spektrum receivers only.

 

There are cheap and perfectly useable Spektrum compatible receivers by brands Lemon and Orange.

 

 

 

 

[MattyB]

55 minutes ago, kc said:

But to 'cut to the chase'   the real answer to Davids question is contained in last weeks thread " Armchair Detective Needed"  where the telemetry from a crash was given and discussed by all the Modelflying usual experts  and the conclusion ( if any! ) was that some update to the Tx may or may not have been done and possibly caused the crash!  Telemetry didn't prevent the crash but an update (not done?) may have caused it!  

 

If someone thinks this is like the Luddites then I would point out that recent thinking about AI seems to suggest the Luddites were on the right track! 

1. That really wasn't the conclusion. In that instance the root cause remains unknown, in part because the OP there did not post up details of how the battery performed on test. I still suspect that was the issue tbh, though I accept the telemetry trace was somewhat unusual.
2. It is true that telemetry did not prevent that particular crash, but in many many cases it will diagnose problems before your model becomes matchwood (e.g. an RX power issue, or poor aerial installation). Having telemetry built into your radio system at low cost can save you huge amounts over the lifetime of the set; it has saved me at least £1500 in avoided crashes over the lifetime of my Taranis and RM radios, much of that near the beginning when we were all trying to understand how best to install 2.4 gear, especially in composite fuselages.
3. Good luck finding a TX out there nowadays that does not receive or require software updates. If your set does not require that it is either sufficiently old that they are no longer developing/supporting it, or it's so basic they've never bothered. Literally every mid-range set upwards now receives software updates, it's part and parcel of being the digital age. Certainly any Spektrum set the OP may consider is going to require the odd software update, so your point is somewhat moot.

Edited February 23, 2023 by MattyB

[MattyB]

46 minutes ago, dave parnham said:

Dont know if its allowed to share this video but id say stick with what you know and maybe upgrade to the NX10 or i think there is a NX14 they seem simple enough.

Having been Futaba all the way and sometimes struggle with my 18 with flaps and curves, i see this as your best route.

Surely a decent model shop can demo one for you over the counter?

 

For the OP I don't disagree, but that does come at a cost - those TXs are ~£500, whilst a Hall effect gimbal TX16S is around £200, and with more functionality too, You pays your money etc.....

Edited February 23, 2023 by MattyB

[Geoff S]

2 hours ago, J D 8 said:

       I am a tad younger than you David but in my primary school once you were past the crayon stage one was expected to get to grips with pen and ink, filling the wells was a designated job for a pupil each morning.

I seem to remember being a so-called ink monitor at Junior school!  At about the same time Biro introduced the ball pens, which we sold, and which cost around £1.50 - a lot of money!

 

Well I've just turned 83 and beginning to feel it (especially on my bike!).  I don't have too much trouble with modern radios but I have the advantage of having messed about with electronics all my life (we sold radios/TVs, too) and computers sice 1961 but I'm beginning to give up learning yet another system.  We have smart phones but I can't be bothered with them too much and much prefer my repairable desktop with its full size keyboard and big vdu. 

 

I find telemetry useful, particularly for electric flight.  It's nice to know the current draw in real time. 

 

 

[extra slim]

I remember the time of the ball pen Geoff. I was too poor to afford a wrist watch, so I drew one on my hand. It was after a while I realised I was living on biro'ed time..

 

Taxi !!!!!!