David Ovenden Posted November 15, 2020 Author Share Posted November 15, 2020 Got on with cutting wing ribs again today so that I now have a full set of ribs for the upper and lower wings. It took a bit of time to work out where to cut the wing tube holes to allow for the dihedral on the outer panels. And then how to accurately cut them. In the end I made a simple jig and used the appropriate drill bit from my 1 - 6mm x 0.1 drill set (1.4mm; 2.8mm; 4.2mm; etc) as spacers to position the rib to cut holes in the right place. Seems to have worked, but it is when the wing is built we will find out for sure. Edited By David Ovenden on 15/11/2020 16:00:22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Robson Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 Looking good David , a nice set of ribs ,I applaud your patience cutting wing ribs is my least favorite job Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 15, 2020 Author Share Posted November 15, 2020 Thanks Eric. Actually, in a strange sort of way I quite enjoyed it. It has been some while since I last cut out ribs by hand. Luckily the wings are parallel chord so I was able to do most of the ribs from only 3 ply templates. Once the templates were made it was reasonably quick to cut the ribs themselves. There is a certain pleasure in selecting the right sheet of balsa; trying to get the most efficient placement of ribs on the sheets to save waste; and in seeing the pile of finished ribs build up as you go. The thing I dislike most is making wing struts and interplane struts (and fairing them ) and I'm not much looking forward to planking the engine nacelles either! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 16, 2020 Author Share Posted November 16, 2020 This morning I set about modifying the design of the tail surfaces. The rudder and elevators are shown on the plans as being solid balsa 5/8" thick. This had to be changed, firstly because of the current balsa shortage and secondly, to save weight. I am using a 1/16th sheet core with built up structure either side. Strong and light. This afternoon I started on building the elevators. I was able to use the scrap wood from cutting the wing ribs to made the (very small) half ribs for the elevator. Feels good using the "waste" balsa to build the model. I think in the past I would probably have cleared the bench and thrown the offcuts in the bin! Edited By David Ovenden on 16/11/2020 15:59:51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Robson Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 Sign of the times David, I made some ribs for a Sea fury I am busy, with they all had jig tabs on which have been cut off and kept instead of binned. it will be a faff but most of them will make ribs for the ailerons. Those old designs were fond of using solid balsa for the rear end I've always built them up for economy and weight saving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 17, 2020 Author Share Posted November 17, 2020 I spent a couple of hours in the workshop this afternoon. I managed to get the structure of the fin mostly done and make some progress with the rudder. Still something of a mystery how I'm going to build the tail end of the fuselage onto the rudder. It goes where the curved dotted line is at the bottom .Something to look forward to? Edited By David Ovenden on 17/11/2020 15:56:02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 17, 2020 Author Share Posted November 17, 2020 The propellers I ordered arrived today. A pair of 10x6 3-blades and a pair of 11x7 3-blade. They look pretty good in terms of being about right for a 30s biplane. Whether they are super efficient we will have to see. 11" is the maximum diameter that will fit between the engine nacelles and the fuselage. I think the 11x7 will work best with my 790kv motors on 4s lipos. However I may try the 10x6 on 5s to see which works best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 18, 2020 Author Share Posted November 18, 2020 Not sure if there is much interest in this project. But I thought posting progress might help to keep me focused and maintain the momentum.. Little more progress today. Ribs added on elevators and rudder and some sanding done. Also cut out the core for the tailplane and some ribs. Hope to get it finished tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff2wings Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 Plenty of interest here David ,it's a biplane after all ! And that's some very nice woodwork there a definite improvement on solid surfaces. Is this your first twin engine, or have you had previous experience with twins?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven S Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 I'm also following your build. I've been thinking of a biplane build for a while now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 18, 2020 Author Share Posted November 18, 2020 Jeff, Yes biplanes are very addictive . To answer your question, not my first twin, but my first biplane twin. I built a sport twin a while back. It was a Doublet built from a Denis Tapsfield plan. That had two 25 2-strokes in it. Flew nicely but I sold it after a bit. Also had a Black Horse Mohawk (electric) and a GA Monospar (also electric) that I bought 2nd hand.The first flight of the Monospar was "interesting" as it had been designed and built with opposite rotating motors. Different thrust angles each side. When I bought it it had both motors working in normal rotation. On take off it veered violently to the left. Just managed to cut the power and level up before it got to ground level. Phew! I have decided that the Condor will be electric as the nacelles are just too small to squeeze in four stroke engines, plus tanks and servos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan p Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 David replies are not always a guide to who is interested in a thread. You have had 1580 views the silent majority!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 As a biplane addict myself (currently refurbishing a Flair SE5a and contemplating an Antonov AN2) I'm certainly interested. I like the technique of a 1.5mm sheet core, stiffened with ribs on each side as a stiff, light structure for tail components. Easier to make than a fully built up component as well. Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Robson Posted November 18, 2020 Share Posted November 18, 2020 Hi David, I know how you feel when you don't get any feed back, I think a lot of modellers are interested but when you build a model most would not build then they can't relate to it so they watch but don't comment. as alan p says look at the views. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel R Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 another silent viewer here lovely work so far David, don't be disparaged by lack of comments, sometimes that just means we can't think of a better way to do anything you're posting pictures of! good to see you've done your best to help stave off the balsa shortage by not using lashings of 1/2" sheet for the tail surfaces are you sure those enyas cannot be pursuaded into the nacelles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EarlyBird Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Another silent witness here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 19, 2020 Author Share Posted November 19, 2020 Posted by Nigel R on 19/11/2020 08:28:18: another silent viewer here lovely work so far David, don't be disparaged by lack of comments, sometimes that just means we can't think of a better way to do anything you're posting pictures of! good to see you've done your best to help stave off the balsa shortage by not using lashings of 1/2" sheet for the tail surfaces are you sure those enyas cannot be pursuaded into the nacelles? The problem with the Enya 53 (or even a Laser 70) is that (too much) of the cylinder head will stick out from the cowl and the nacelles are really small so there is not enough room for a decent size tank even with a micro throttle servo. The last thing you want with a twin is to run out of fuel! I will keep all the rib templates. IF the model flies well on electric I might build another modified lower wing centre section to accommodate a pair of four strokes - there was a later version of the Condor 2 that had slighter bigger cowl and longer nacelles. Then I could have the best of both worlds. For the time being its enough to build one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 19, 2020 Author Share Posted November 19, 2020 Been sorting out the scrap heap this morning. Anything work keeping? Given the current situation I decided to keep the pile on the right! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 I've got boxes of bits like the pile on the right, it's amazing how often it saves me cutting into a new sheet. Can I ask what you are using for the wing joiners? I have a Royal Curtis P-6E kit with one piece wings that I plan on building with separate outer panels - eventually! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 19, 2020 Author Share Posted November 19, 2020 Bob, I'm using some carbon tubes as wing joiners. I have 12mm joiner on the front spar (in 14mm carbon tubes in the wing) and 8mm on the rear spar. Its only for the tip panels as the centre section with motors is in one piece (3 piece wing). There will be functional rigging wires too, so its rather overkill but I felt they would beef up the wing without adding sheeting and extra spars. It will hopefully be a robust system that will make sliding the outer panels on easier and less fiddly. We shall see. I did have a Royal P6-E kit but sold it some years back. Lovely kit, but I just had too many projects (like the Condor) to realistically ever get round finishing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 I take it the joiners are tubes? I have some solid rod from a Carbon-Z Cub joiner that I thought should be up to the job for the mainspar area, I think it's about 10mm diameter. Maybe a 6mm rod on the rear spar. I really can't deal with a mass of wing and strut bolts to assemble a model at the field these days so it's plug in wing panels or it ends up another wall hanging . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Like Bob, I have boxes of wood pieces too small to be of further use ... and then find they are useful and usually save hacking into a full sheet for a small amount. When I'm building from a kit I avoid thrwing anything away until its finished and, even then, a lot goes into the aforementioned boxes. With the current balsa situation, it's even more worthwhile. Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 19, 2020 Author Share Posted November 19, 2020 Bob, The front ones are 12mm o/d (10mm i/d) tubes. The rear ones are 6mm solid rod in 8mm tubes. The sizes were determined by what was available from HK (not much) and what could be accommodated in the wing ribs allowing for dihedral on the outer panels. I can't imagine that your 10mm solid rods wouldn't do just fine. The Carbon-Z cub is designed to be "chucked about" after all. Edited By David Ovenden on 19/11/2020 16:15:05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwain Dibley. Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Never throw anything away .................. Until just before you need it. D.D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ovenden Posted November 19, 2020 Author Share Posted November 19, 2020 Didn't get as much building much done today as hoped. Had to repair a chainsaw instead! In the end I just got one side of the tailplane assembled. Other side tomorrow once the glue has dried. Edited By David Ovenden on 19/11/2020 20:34:36 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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