BMFA SUBS 2024 ????

[Ron Gray]

Just now, Peter Jenkins said:

Indeed!  Sorry, thought I'd read it somewhere but just cannot find where it was posted. I'm happy to admit I am wrong on this.

I posted it above based on information given a few weeks ago. It would appear that the 'deal' has fallen through but I do see that the LMA are based in Buckminster, have they always been there?

[Peter Jenkins]

35 minutes ago, Ron Gray said:

I posted it above based on information given a few weeks ago. It would appear that the 'deal' has fallen through but I do see that the LMA are based in Buckminster, have they always been there?

No, the LMA was never in the frame for being hosted at Buckminster when the original decision to lease Buckminster was taken.

[leccyflyer]

1 hour ago, Ron Gray said:

27th - 29th September - Laser Day and Best of British.

I'd have to take my laser apart to fit it in the car Ron and even then it would take up room that could be allocated to models, so it probably wouldn't be that weekend.

[Ron Gray]

8 hours ago, Peter Jenkins said:

No, the LMA was never in the frame for being hosted at Buckminster when the original decision to lease Buckminster was taken.

Screen shot from the LMA’s website

 

[Ron Gray]

8 hours ago, leccyflyer said:

I'd have to take my laser apart to fit it in the car Ron and even then it would take up room that could be allocated to models, so it probably wouldn't be that weekend.

Forget the Laser then and just come flying over the other 2 days!

[Cuban8]

I watched the BMFA AGM on-line and I have to say that I got the impression that the association accepts that it faces some very difficult times over the next few years. Not an existential problem per se but one of a falling and ageing membership and consequently, fewer resourses to maintain themselves as the primary provider of support to model flying in the UK. There was talk of raising the subs to £50 but this was thrown out. £50 would not have been an unreasonable amount in my opinion and I guess that the subs will be going that way next time. I find it amazing how parsimonious some of us are when it comes to supporting BMFA - it's not a poor man's hobby as you'll see if you take a look at your own club and the money spent by many members on their hobby. Not all, by any means, but very few of us are flying our models and enjoying our hobby  in a 'hand to mouth' fashion where every last penny counts.

At least one thing that I've been on about for ages was put through and that was scrapping the wasteful hard copy of BMFA news being posted out for all. If I understood correctly it'll be on-line only and back to six editions a year - a very large saving indeed and long overdue IMHO. Buckminster either will or will not be a success in the medium to long term and although I was against its founding in the first place, I see what has been done up there and commend everyone's efforts to get where it is now - maybe I'll take a detour when I'm up that way visiting family and have a look round and bring a model for the day.

BMFA will face a steadily falling membership over the next few years - costs will increase and the scope of its work will almost certinly have to reined in. Disasterous? well, maybe not when one looks at the memberships of the associations that look after the interests of those modellers in New Zealand and Australia as examples. Far fewer clubs and way fewer people  but they appear to remain an effective force for their members although nothing on the scale or reach of the present BMFA.

Think carefully before flouncing off in a huff  to another supplier of insurance for the sake of a few pennies a week extra.

.

[kc]

On 25/11/2023 at 19:45, john stones 1 - Moderator said:

Why is it when we come under pressure, financially/regulation etc, some always look for a scapegoat to blame ?

In business people look to the loss making subsidary and close them or make them break even BEFORE it affects the main business.   

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

2 minutes ago, kc said:

In business people look to the loss making subsidary and close them or make them break even BEFORE it affects the main business.   

 

Aye, and they identify actual causes rather than look to imaginary ones.

[Brian Cooper]

Strewth, what a lot of whingers. 

 

The BMFA does great work for the sport/hobby. .  It's a thankless task, and their main problem is they don't shout about it. 

So every year we get the same old whingers complaining about a derisory increase in the subscription. 

 

Some folk really need to get a grip on reality. 

If people aren't prepared to pay the paltry subscription to support the National body, then they are in the wrong hobby. 

 

[kc]

On 25/11/2023 at 19:31, john stones 1 - Moderator said:

If you believe the venture happened to supply these people a venue, you might have a case, I'm confident that isn't the case and singling them out is false, the Trents close by, but the Red Sea is some way away.

 

Whats Red Sea quote mean? 

I thought the SMAE originally intended to invest the money they had in the bank for any defence of aeromodelling  by buying land but instead the BMFA didnt buy land outright but just bought a lease on Buckminster.    When the lease expires what will we own?    I reckon that SMAE members thought that land would be bought where it was needed by members - near centres of population like London .

Buckminster gives a great flying field for those few who live nearby at far less cost than my local club fees!    If Buckminster runs at a loss I am subsidising them.    A loss of £1978 was quoted earlier and figure of depreciation of £33,103 surely shows the scale of the matter.   Meanwhile clubs around London are losing flying sites to housebuilding or facing huge rent increases yet because they have to have 100percent BMFA membership they are forced to pay for Buckminster even if they don't fly there.   

 

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

11 minutes ago, kc said:

Whats Red Sea quote mean? 

I thought the SMAE originally intended to invest the money they had in the bank for any defence of aeromodelling  by buying land but instead the BMFA didnt buy land outright but just bought a lease on Buckminster.    When the lease expires what will we own?    I reckon that SMAE members thought that land would be bought where it was needed by members - near centres of population like London .

Buckminster gives a great flying field for those few who live nearby at far less cost than my local club fees!    If Buckminster runs at a loss I am subsidising them.    A loss of £1978 was quoted earlier and figure of depreciation of £33,103 surely shows the scale of the matter.   Meanwhile clubs around London are losing flying sites to housebuilding or facing huge rent increases yet because they have to have 100percent BMFA membership they are forced to pay for Buckminster even if they don't fly there.   

 

Red Sea ? was parted by Moses to lead the "Chosen" people to the promised land AKA Buckminster, which was alleged to be the reason it's there, not true.

Rest of your post is distraction and some untruths, you've already been told by Andy S who/what covered the shortfall. The reasons behind lease not purchase have been written large and openly and discussed to death.

[steve too]

On 25/11/2023 at 19:34, Andy Symons - BMFA said:

No money from the main BMFA income, (subs), is used to fund Buckminster ...

 

What's this "Support from BMFA" then?

 

 

(2021 AGM budget)

 

On 25/11/2023 at 19:42, Andy Symons - BMFA said:

... Buckminster reserve ...

 

Where did the £ 1/3 million that was used to create the Buckminster Reserve come from? And what was the balance of the reserve on the 31st March?

 

[steve too]

2 hours ago, Cuban8 said:

... Buckminster either will or will not be a success in the medium to long term ...

 

How long is the lease?

[Learner]

Cant understand why the people unhappy with the cost of bmfa membership and Buckminster dont just leave, pool the £47 each their going to save and buy a field simple!

Edited November 27, 2023 by Learner

[steve too]

Just now, Learner said:

Cant understand why the people unhappy with the cost of bmfa membership dont just leave ...

 

The BMFA's problem is that the membership is dropping, maybe one of the reasons for this is that people are doing precisely what you suggest. Incidentally, FPV-UK has 8000 members.

[kc]

7 minutes ago, Learner said:

Cant understand why the people unhappy with the cost of bmfa membership dont just leave, pool the £47 each their going to save and buy a field simple!

Because local clubs insist on 100 percent BMFA membership so people cannot opt out without losing their flying field!

[Peter Jenkins]

1 minute ago, steve too said:

 

The BMFA's problem is that the membership is dropping, maybe one of the reasons for this is that people are doing precisely what you suggest. Incidentally, FPV-UK has 8000 members.

Your problem is you can't be bothered to research the lead up to the acquisition of the Buckminster lease.  If you joined after the Buckminster lease was agreed then research it.  If you were a member before and during the acquisitoon process you would have known that an acquisition was considered but eventually ruled unaffordable.  The Buckminster lease was agreed at 35 years with regular breakpoints.  You would also have known that a fund was set up and many people gave generously to the Buckminster fund as it was agreed that no BMFA subscription income was to be used.  Our insurers also agrred to provide sponsorship.

 

Those are the headlines as far as I can remember then.

 

Now be a good chap find out the details by asking for the minutes of the EGM and the subsequent fund that was set up.  When you've taken the trouble to do that have the grace to apologise for your ill informed comments.

[Peter Jenkins]

2 minutes ago, kc said:

Because local clubs insist on 100 percent BMFA membership so people cannot opt out without losing their flying field!

Go and form your own unaffiliated club then.  Simples.

[Christopher Long 1]

37 minutes ago, steve too said:

Where did the £ 1/3 million that was used to create the Buckminster Reserve come from? And what was the balance of the reserve on the 31st March?

From the accounts presented to this years AGM
Balance at 31 March 2023    £218,830

 

From what I remember the money used was from BMFA funds that had been built up over the years from donations etc to provide for a National Centre.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Christopher Long 1

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

4 minutes ago, kc said:

Because local clubs insist on 100 percent BMFA membership so people cannot opt out without losing their flying field!

 

Local clubs choose or not choose to affiliate, take your concern there. BMFA can force nothing on you.

[steve too]

4 minutes ago, Christopher Long 1 said:

From what I remember the money used was from BMFA funds that had been built up over the years from donations etc to provide for a National Centre.

 

(Accounts for year ending March 2016 at Companies House.)

 

[Andy Symons - BMFA]

5 hours ago, kc said:

Buckminster gives a great flying field for those few who live nearby at far less cost than my local club fees!    If Buckminster runs at a loss I am subsidising them.    A loss of £1978 was quoted earlier and figure of depreciation of £33,103 surely shows the scale of the matter.   Meanwhile clubs around London are losing flying sites to housebuilding or facing huge rent increases yet because they have to have 100percent BMFA membership they are forced to pay for Buckminster even if they don't fly there.   

 

You are not subsidising them. Not one penny of the £42 you paid for your 2023 membership was used to subsidise them. However as I mentioned previously you have still benefitted indirectly, the BMFA didn't have to spend some of the pennies you paid to hire venues that we would have had to previously because we were able to use Buckminster. Buckminster has also proved very useful in promoting model aircraft flying and helping to put our sport in to the public eye. Something all model aircraft flyers benefit from. In years when the BMFA makes a surplus of over £10k £10k will be transferred to the National Centre reserve. But only if there is a healthy surplus, the BMFA does have some other income streams apart from membership subscriptions though and £10k is probably a lot less then would have to be paid to hire venues annually that now no longer need to be hired. Your subs are not used to fund Buckminster. 

Clubs are not forced to have 100% BMFA membership, it is a choice they make to affiliate because they consider the benefits of affiliation are worth it. It's actually a bit of a no-brainer when you consider all the benefits that otherwise the club would have to pay for.

[Ron Gray]

@Andy Symons - BMFAwell said that man!

[Frank Skilbeck]

15 hours ago, john stones 1 - Moderator said:

 

Local clubs choose or not choose to affiliate, take your concern there. BMFA can force nothing on you.

Yep and be prepared to take over the running of the club, you may find that the current committee wouldn't be prepared to continue without the backing/safety net of the club being affiliated.

[Nigel Heather]

Just renewed mine - 50p increase on last year because I dropped the rewards card (it was nice to have in the wallet but found I wasn't using it).  Will miss the magazines but to be honest, I never really read them, just a quick skim through before consigning them to recycling.

 

Not surprised by the magazine becoming a costed extra - I sensed it was heading that way when the number of pages and the quality of the paper increased.  I'd not be surprised if the paper magazine ceases if insufficient members stump up the £10.

Edited December 2, 2023 by Nigel Heather