Kit builders, what would you like???

[Philflyer]

Any modern civilian single engine low wing light aircraft, a Glasair 2 or Cessna 350 type. Curvy lines with fixed gear. Max 70" span cause it must fit in my car. 40 to 60 glow or petrol. Veneered foam or plastic bits and f/glass not plastic cowl. Low parts count or a semi kit with a good plan i.e. when the parts are copied from the plan they do actually fit together. Maximum £100. I'm the odd one out aren't I.

[Jon H]

We have already discussed the idea of a collaboration to allow easy fitment of not only Laser's but any engine you choose to fit. Its a pain when kits are designed around one engine so something universal is a far better idea.

im pleased to see so much support for twins. There are very few on the market and even fewer that are good and well priced.

I also wonder if a sport twin would be something worth while as there are virtually no sport twins available for people to learn how to handle two engines. Most people make mistakes in single engine flight so some training on a more forgiving model would be a good idea before they embark on a scale job.

And for reference, if you loose an engine on a twin DO NOT shut down the other one. Keep it running and maintain your airspeed. If you dont its all over

[Michael Ramsay-Fraser]

Well, given the name, Warbird Replicas, I would suggest staying away from civilian craft.

I'm always tempted by the Warbirds Spitfire as it looks to be a proper builders model but having a TN Spitfire and an old Balsacraft one still waiting to be built, I don't think I could justify another.

For my part, the building is the real pleasure I get from this hobby so anything WW1 or 2 would be fine as long as it has built up wings. and at a scale that allows a reasonable level of detail. Twin would be good too, particularly a German one. There are plenty of varients to choose from and one basic model that could allow adaptations for different types or marks would be briliant. Not asking much, i know.

If I was to choose one, though, it would have to be a Whirlwind.

[IanN]

The current Warbirds Replicas kits look great but imo it's the size (ooh errr ) that's a bit "old hat" these days with most around 55" wingspan. There's definitely a place for those, but things have moved on and imo there is an equal market for those of us who would like to go that little bit larger without necessarily having the wherewithal or the ability to go into "giant" scale

I'd say go for models around the 65-72" mark. My pref at that size for weight/wing loading reasons would be all built up construction. No reason why there shouldn't be a foam option for those who prefer

[alan p]

keep to the smaller engines

Whirlwind

Anson/oxford

BV 141

Dornier 335 (its a twin but not as we know it)

[Levanter]

Philflyer - You and I are in the wrong thread it seems but I have to support John's idea of a sport twin coupled with your suggestion to take something from modern GA where there are some really exciting curvy offerings.

And - Has anybody tried a ballistic parachute in a model - the ultimate failsafe?

[Stumps]

Posted by Jon Harper - Laser Engines on 22/04/2016 10:27:51:

As a Hurricane lover this is a good shout. My MR Hurricane was nice but was lacking somewhat in the scale outline as it lacked the 3 piece wing of the much smaller warbirds kit and this did irritate me a bit. if Richard's existing Hurricane was scaled up to 80 inch and flying weight of 14-18lbs that would be well within reach of 120-200 4 strokes or petrol 20-30cc.

That would be sweet...

[Jon H]

Posted by Philflyer on 22/04/2016 12:39:27:

Any modern civilian single engine low wing light aircraft, a Glasair 2 or Cessna 350 type. Curvy lines with fixed gear. Max 70" span cause it must fit in my car. 40 to 60 glow or petrol. Veneered foam or plastic bits and f/glass not plastic cowl. Low parts count or a semi kit with a good plan i.e. when the parts are copied from the plan they do actually fit together. Maximum £100. I'm the odd one out aren't I.

A little and i think that price point is a little optimistic for a model of that size.

As for the weight of foam core models, that all depends on the specific foam used and the glue/veneer used as well. Times have moved on and the foam/glue/wood combination Richard uses is very light weight and very strong. Personally, i like the foam wings/decks as they really speed construction of the model and allow me to focus on modifications and extras

[will -0]

I've always thought the IAR80 would make a fine model:

http://www.aviastar.org/pictures/romania/iar-80.gif

**LINK**

How many you'd sell is another matter

[will -0]

PS also, something that doesn't require retracts would be great for those with short funds and rougher grass strips

[RICHARD WILLS]

Will , what a great shape IAR80 is . Reminds me of the Hughes racer . Very cool.

I think we'd be on our own there so production run of two perhaps!

Im glad everybody is chipping in . This is definitely the way to get things done,

It seems that we need to look at two different designs here so perhaps if we phrase the question like this :

I agree that the slightly larger model has an appeal . From what everyone is saying ,65-70 inch is the zone .

Jonathons engines certainly could be accommodated with an optional firewall . So we all need to come up with a subject for say a single engined warbird of that size. The good news is that we have made our own all metal super tough retracts that we can offer along side the kit in order to keep the cost down and the reliability up.

Secondly a twin that can be electrically or Ic powered of 70" span needs to be chosen . Having built an flown lots of twins this size in both IC and electric form , I can honestly tell you that they are the business!

The electric versions are very easy to get on with and thanks to the big 3 blade props and the noise generated from them , they look and sound surprisingly real .No engine out issues either , Also remember that at 72" they are quite easy to get in the car as the body is quite small and the wing slides down the side of the car with thespinners pointing skyward . Even a Ford Fiesta will accommodate one .

Alternatively the sound of a pair of fourstrokes is beautiful and totally addictive so the models would be capable of either version . Cost is not prohibitive . Each motor /esc/battery being about £100 .on the electric version.

I dont want to lead you but here are some of the singles we thought would work at 65-70"

La7 , Tempest , Sea Fury , Macchi , Yak , Heinkell 100 , Tony .

Twins : P38 , Mossie , Whirlwind , 110G, 410 . ,He111,

Multi 100" all electric B17 .

Like I say , other suggestions welcome , but we do have some prototypes of the above or at least moulds and plans so they have a head start and would reduce lead times.

Retracts have always been expensive with some companies and can double the cost so we need to keep that area in house and containable.

Richard

[IanN]

A Tempest and a Whirlwind around 65-70" would both tempt me a LOT.

Hands up to test build the first production trial run!

[Andy Meade]

A nice selection Richard - Tempest, He111, and B17 for me please...where do I pay? I'm afraid I'd make the B17 (whisper it) PSS though

No Butcher Bird on the list

[David P Williams]

Tempest (II not V, don't like that big chin scoop although it would hide the engine), Mossie (but hasn't TN just done one this size?), P38, 410.

[David Molineux]

A really good Sea Fury would be nice. I'd love to build an ME 262 or a BF 110...

Dave

[Stephen Newing]

Retracts can be a real pain on a rough patch. I'd buy a Gladiator, Bristol Bulldog or maybe a Hart (provided the struttery wasn't too complicated). 60 size would be good, could use one of the smaller petrols.

[Dave Hopkin]

A trainer twin would be good..... surely there must be some military twins than would lend themselves to being made as a semi-scale trainer .....

[IanR]

Still the P-38 Lightning at 72"

[MattyB]

Posted by IanR on 22/04/2016 17:25:01:

Still the P-38 Lightning at 72"

I would strongly advise against a P-38, not cos I don't like them but because Lockheed Martin are notorious for aggressively pursuing kit manufacturers who utilise their designs - yes, I really am not making this up...!

Edited By MattyB on 22/04/2016 17:38:26

[RICHARD WILLS]

Yes Stephen , retracts can be a pain on our typical British strips . However a lot of the problems can be alleviated .

I always put a heavy piano wire coil in the top of the leg because most of the impact force is backward rather than upward . That helps tremendously . Also our all metal units are proper heavy duty alloy and not pot metal . That means that the impact cannot get beyond the lock so at the point of impact the undercarriage effectively becomes a simple fixed system. Dont let me put you off your Gladiator /Hart . Both wonderrful.

Regarding the "twin trainer" Dave, I totally agree . However in electric form , most of the twins can be made to fly very benignly . Our prototype Ju88 NightFighter kit being built elsewhere on this forum is exactly that .

Because of the simple lines of the 88 it can be prefabricated by us to produce a big model very quickly .

You just pop in two 4cell packs and chocks away ! Even the paint job is a doddle , ok its not a Mossie but that is a much more complicated model because it really will involve planking thanks to the curves.

Possibly too big a jump for the first twin . Having said that if somebody built something like the 88 first to get the feel of things , all of the equipment (motors props esc etc ) could be moved to the more sophisticated twin afterwards.. Having flown the 88 for a while , i'd have to say it is pretty stress free for such an adventurous looking model . On a low pass with those big three blade props turning it certainly looks menacing .

The big twins are very smooth and compared to say the Spitfire , everything happens in slow motion thanks to the bigger mass. There is no worry about the motors conking out and I have fitted the Mr RCsound system which is extra fun though not necessary as the plane make quite a nice drone anyway .

[Jon H]

Richard as you know you can count me in for a 72 inch Whirlwind I will even help design those flaps!

I am ok for singles at the moment so will leave that up to the rest of the guys.

Regarding the fragility of retracts I have flown my retract equipped models from grass at every club I have flown at and have only damaged them when my landings were rubbish. While its true that retracts are not as forgiving at fixed gear, the primary problem is that the landing itself was not that clever in the first place. One guy at my club damaged his retracts on every landing until I took him through a proper landing approach and got him to practice it for a full day so that was identical every time. Since then I don't think he has even bounced a warbird landing let alone do any damage.

Richards method of using a coil spring will protect you if you do make a bad landing but it can also lead the model to nose over even if the landing is good. My preference is a solidly mounted oleo and to make my landings good enough to not break the retract mounts

[RICHARD WILLS]

Ah Jon , I hope youre not trying to lead the jury ?

The Whirlwind is an unusual subject to be sure , Interesting history and certainly you would be the only one in the club .

Have a look at this rather fetching colour scheme (Dieppe raid I assume, hope he made it back ok , not many did) ::

http://barracudacals.com/gallery/index.php/Classic-Airframes-1-48-Whirlwind---by-Calum-Gibson---New-South-Wales-Australia/Whirlwind-28

It is quite racey isnt it ? What does everyone else think ? 72" ? Big props short and sturdy U/C .

"Its got legs " as they say , even if they are from a Daschund !

Surprisingly graceful in the air and cuts some nice shapes with the high tail . Those big flaps should haul it up short on the landing ,

Cant imagine Westland coming after us like Lockeed . They are British after all and some of my aunts live in the west country so they could probably have a word.

Nobody would mess with Auntie Violet ,

[Paul Johnson 4]

Hi guys
got to this forum thanks to Richard after purchasing his Spitfire kit and a chat we had on the phone.
I would love to see a Bristol Beaufighter.
Not only a under modeled subject but a very under rated aircraft.
I have a preference for electric as I love to fly early, 7:30 ish, and electric allows this.
we need to support these guys in their and our passion for warbird rc.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Jon H]

Posted by RICHARD WILLS on 22/04/2016 19:56:42:

Ah Jon , I hope youre not trying to lead the jury ?

The other guys want one too! Its not just me