Battery connectors

[fly boy3]

Hi all, I assume this has been discussed previously. I would like to ask a few questions. Do folk have many adaptors, or is it a soldering job quite often.  Do the same batteries come with different connectors. Thanks

Edited By fly boy3 on 30/07/2020 19:32:02

[Jesus Cardin]

I can only speak for me, but regarding your questions:

- Do folk have many adaptors?...I just own one, this is for using XT60 connector batteries with T-Deans ESCs (T-Deans is my standard).

-is it a soldering job quite often?...Well I intend buying only batteries with T-Deans connectors but, of course, i keep some females T-Deans connectors for if I get a battery with a different connector. I find soldering T-Deans connectors not too difficult.

-Do the same batteries come with different connectors?....Not those I normally use. My preferred brand have been always offered with T-Deans. Anyway I know other brands that switched battery connector when they upgraded batteries C´s; I think they though that their new, more powerful, batteries would be used on more demanding models and they changed from T-Deans to XT60.

[leccyflyer]

Don't use adaptors, always just solder my preferred 4mm connectors onto newly arrived batteries and ESCs. Adapters are just one more unnecessary thing that might be a point of failure in flight.

[Allan Bennett]

If I were starting again I might use XT60 connectors because they're easier to solder than Deans, but I started with Deans so I stick with them partly because they're physically smaller. If the battery I buy has XT60 connectors I cut them off and solder a Deans on. I don't use adapters other than for bench-testing new batteries before I've changed their connectors.

My main source of batteries these days is HK, and they seem to come with XT60 as standard, though I have had some larger ones from them with no connector. Overlander give you a choice of connector on most of their batteries.

[Martin McIntosh]

I would forget Deans now since most common packs come with the superior XT series.

[Erfolg]

The time of the Deans and Bullet connectors should now be in the distant past.

Most Lipos come with XT plugs, more often than not XT60, for the sizes and watts that I operate at.

In the past i used Deans plugs, a faff to solder. When Lipos came with Deans (more often than not clones), it was only the ESC that I had to worry about. Just a bind, not the easiest plugs to solder and then heat shrink to protect the soldered connection. Once the Lipo suppliers predominantly switched to XT plugs, as Deans were playing hard ball (counter productive as even less genuine plugs will now be sold), cutting the plug of a live battery introduced an additional risk, as did soldering.

I do have a number of conversion plugs, that I have made up myself. As to additional point of failure, I see it as vanishingly small. That is particularly when I have and seen others use arming plugs, as a safety precaution, in some circumstances.

I started initially with Bullet connectors, then went to shrouded bullet connectors. I saw a number of accidents using Bullets and have heard of some nasty accidents. The shrouded connectors used a lot of space and were then expensive, plus in recent years I have not seen any.

[Richard Clark 2]

Posted by Martin McIntosh on 30/07/2020 20:42:52:

I would forget Deans now since most common packs come with the superior XT series.

Having used both I'm not sure which is better. Deans use proper strongly sprung contacts rather than relying on the rather soft and not noticeably springy contacts the XT connectors use. But there are many fake Deans connectors.

A test. If it hasn't got noticeably warm after a minute or two of uninterrupted full power usage and remains so after several months of flying it's fine.

BVM Jets still use standard genuine US made Deans connectors on their very high power EDFs.

[Jesus Cardin]

Along the years I have used all popular battery connectors: started with normal Tamiya plugs, then upgraded to gold Tamiya ones, later I switched to 4mm bullet connectors -both open and shrouded- to finally start using Deans when I got my first Li-Pos, but I also have experience with XT60 as I also operate model planes from my uncle and as his models are very large he adopted the XT60 as standard. I have never have any problem with any of them and never suffered heat or distortion due to bad contact and this even reaching currents of just over 60 Amps iin the ole good times with Ni-Cd batteries and gold Tamiya connectors!.

Anyway I opted to stay with Deans due to small size and being appropriate enough for the actual currents on my models. Also, against what I have read a lot of times in this forum, soldering Deans connectors has not proved any problem for me, even using just a 15W solder and not being, really, a soldering genius.

For adaptors, many years ago I made them using a short cable between connectors but learned from expert that that produced loses so my only adapter todays is made soldering direct a female XT60 connector to a male T-Deans one and I use it with my last charger (ISDT Q6 Pro) when charging Deans Li-Po and when using those for flying my uncle large models....with total success for now!

[Erfolg]

Richard

I truly believe that the day of the Deans belongs in the past.

I do not recognise the description of the XT plug either. Having cut one or two apart, I see essentially a bullet connector in a bespoke housing. The design of the housing is superior to many other connectors, in that both components making the whole, effectively shield both the male and female contacts. The shaped key of the the plug bodies makes deliberate incorrect insertion, next to impossible.

Even in the day, Deans were OK, at best, even the so called real thing.

Perhaps a better connector will one day supplant the XT type, although it will take some doing.

[PeterF]

I fly all electric now with a number of models in the 60 to 100Amp range up to 8S as well as a lot of smaller models. Rather than messing about, all packs have anti spark XT90 connectors because I often series connect packs for the higher voltage models.

[leccyflyer]

I have been flying electric since the mid-90;s and exclusively electric for about the past 18 years, I settled on the 4mm "gold" bullet connectors fairly early on, had a brief dalliance with Deans connectors on a few models, before reverting to the bullets. Their simplicity the lack of bulk in my preferred small models and the flexibility in being able to make serial connections without adding any bulky adaptors or extra cables.

Over the years all sorts of increasingly bulky plastic housings around essentially bullet connections have come and gone, In all of those case they have been clipped from the batteries and replaced with polarised 4mm bullets, with unequal lead length and a single wrap of tape making inadvertent connection of the pack to itself impossible. The ease of soldering the bullet connections makes prepping a new model's ESC and battery a trivial matter -including adding a U-Bec on lots of models and it works for me.

The time and hassle in changing a brand of connectors ought not be under-estimated, especially with a large number of models already fitted out -so it pays to make a good decision and to stick with that standard. It makes me laugh when I read such bold statements that connector "x" is the next big thing, or for that matter that connector "y" is a thing of the past -with the possible exception of those horrible Tamiya connectors.

I do have one second hand model which has those big bulky blue XT connectors. The extremely heavy duty cables are too thick to fit into a 4mm bullet connector, so I have two 6s1p5000mah packs that I cannot use in any other models-which is a bit of a pain.

[iflylilplanes]

When I first started in electric 20 years ago, Deans were all the go, the XT60 then came out, looked nice, but all my gear was Deans. I then had a near Lipo fire, caused by a Deans plug, the spring on the top tee pin bent and shorted out the battery as it was plugged in, pulled the battery just in time. After that incident, I purchased a pack of 20 XT60's and changed every battery and ESC over to XT60 and never looked back. I found the XT connectors easy to fit/solder both XT60 and XT90, have not used the XT30's as yet, I'll be using them in my comp ALES gliders in the future.

Cheers,

Dave

[perttime]

What about small models? Still XT?

[Richard Clark 2]

Posted by leccyflyer on 30/07/2020 23:42:12:

I have been flying electric since the mid-90;s and exclusively electric for about the past 18 years, I settled on the 4mm "gold" bullet connectors fairly early on, had a brief dalliance with Deans connectors on a few models, before reverting to the bullets. Their simplicity the lack of bulk in my preferred small models and the flexibility in being able to make serial connections without adding any bulky adaptors or extra cables.

Over the years all sorts of increasingly bulky plastic housings around essentially bullet connections have come and gone, In all of those case they have been clipped from the batteries and replaced with polarised 4mm bullets, with unequal lead length and a single wrap of tape making inadvertent connection of the pack to itself impossible. The ease of soldering the bullet connections makes prepping a new model's ESC and battery a trivial matter -including adding a U-Bec on lots of models and it works for me.

The time and hassle in changing a brand of connectors ought not be under-estimated, especially with a large number of models already fitted out -so it pays to make a good decision and to stick with that standard. It makes me laugh when I read such bold statements that connector "x" is the next big thing, or for that matter that connector "y" is a thing of the past -with the possible exception of those horrible Tamiya connectors.

I do have one second hand model which has those big bulky blue XT connectors. The extremely heavy duty cables are too thick to fit into a 4mm bullet connector, so I have two 6s1p5000mah packs that I cannot use in any other models-which is a bit of a pain.

Good thoughtful comments.

But I suspect the connectors many people favour at any given time is more down to marketing than anything else.

They will of course deny that because we all like to think that being 'wise' we are 'above' such things but it isn't true. Only penniless hermits are immune to marketing.

What do I use? I started with the six pin green Multiplex connectors, which can be used for many things. Using three pins per wire they are rated at 30 Amps and I still use then in smaller planes..

Then I moved to Deans for medium sized planes. I didn't particularly like them but the genuine ones are rated at 50 amps but will take far more.

Now I mostly use the yellow XT60 or XT90 even though it is an inherently bad design electrically as a tube with a split along it fitting into another tube relies entirely on the correct split tube material.  Theirs is chosen only to be as low cost as possible and still 'sort of' work after repeated insertions and removals.

On my 'up to 5 Kilowatt' EDFs I have stayed with Deans on the 'If it's good enough for BVM Jets at 7 Kilowatts it's good enough for me' basis. And they don't get even warm, let alone hot. Which is the most important factor.

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 31/07/2020 06:59:44

[Trevor Crook]

I use XT60s (almost) throughout, none of my models pull 60A continuous so I haven't bothered with XT90s. I said almost, because I've used XT30s on a couple of small models, these are really handy for small spaces.

I find them easy to solder and sleeve (with the correct heatshrink) and foolproof to use. Never had one overheat or fail. Some can be a little stiff to make and break though.

I've soldered pairs of XT60s and 30s back to back to make adaptors for my wattmeter, but don't use them for any flying.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Trevor]

Not so much a proposal, more an admission, but, being a bit of a dinosaur, I still use Anderson Powerpoles (aka `Sermos' ) connectors. They've served me well in over 30 years of electric flight and, as has been said, the hassle of changing to anything else at this stage doesn't bear thinking about!

Trevor

Edited By Trevor on 31/07/2020 08:19:44

[Engine Doctor]

I used Deans exclusively for years as changing them for XT 60 was a longish job. Then one of the deans connector spring tabs broke and the connector got very hot very quickly. Luckily I spotted it as it could have caused a fire in the model. Since then have been changing over to XT 60 and a few XT 90 . IMO a far superior and safe plug that's easier to grip when pulling apart and the newer versions have a decent cover for the soldered joints.

[John Lee]

One of the best uses I ever had of a wet afternoon, when I would otherwise have been flying, was to change everything over to XT connectors.

[Dickw]

I use 4mm bullet connections for most applications because of their small size, flexibility in use in various serial and other applications, ease of soldering, and ease of connecting/disconnecting. For some heavy current applications I use 6mm bullets for similar reasons but with higher current carrying capacity (150A plus) and because some of the equipment I use (e.g. current sensors) only comes with those fittings.

The only adaptors I use are for swapping between 4mm and 6mm on my chargers.

Dick

[Erfolg]

I do not recognise the split tube that has been mentioned on the XT connectors. I have checked the connectors i presently have. They all are off the solid conductor stock material. The male plug is slit, the female a unbroken tube.

I have had at least two male connectors in the past that were male 4mm sprung bullet connectors in the past. Why I cut the conductors out of the body, is now lost in the mist of time. These in principal could be better.

What particularly spurred me into a change to XT is that I consume quite a few Lipo batteries, say in a 12 month period. I was concerned with respect to the safety issues when cutting off a XT plug on the Lipo, even with a strict sequence of operations. So changing one ESC connector was safer.

I have always found the soldering of Deans plugs a bit of an issue, using a multi-hand (helping hand) type crocodile clip base. Invariably the Lipo had to be packed up, this was to remove any strain on the crocodile clip, the Deans body also not the easiest to hold securely.

Bullet connectors are easy, drill a hole in a piece of balsa (scrap), push the connector into the hole, place upright on the bench (or what ever), Using the multi-hand insert the wire conductor (vertically) into the solder socket, then solder the joint (having pre tinned).

I do XT connectors in a similar way, although now, I have a piece of balsa, with a few restraints Cyno on, which hold the connector.

I see two significant advantages immediately, I now change connectors less frequently, more so as time passes. Perhaps IMO the process has far less hazards and exhibits increased safety than working on a live Lipo.

As to the functionality of the plugs, who other than those with an axe to grind has a operational and functional issue with them? Generally not users.

When bullets were the common method, there were instances that the sprung cage was not of the quality in the longer term that ensured functionality. My main concern having witnessed some one pug two batteries together, that a strict protocol was required, then I have seen a unshielded male connector make contact with the case of a metal box (there was no consequence).

In short we can all point at supposed failings of any piece of equipment. Much come down to both safety and convenance.

 

Edited By Erfolg on 31/07/2020 10:40:50

Edited By Erfolg on 31/07/2020 10:42:03

[Richard Clark 2]

Posted by Erfolg on 31/07/2020 10:39:58:

I do not recognise the split tube that has been mentioned on the XT connectors. I have checked the connectors i presently have. They all are off the solid conductor stock material. The male plug is slit, the female a unbroken tube.a similar way, although now, I have a piece of balsa, with a few restraints Cyno on, which hold the connector..........

 

The XT90s I checked before I made my post the males are hollow (thus I described it as a tube). It is quite thin walled. They are cross slit at 90 degrees thus giving four quadrants. The ends are pressed over in a tight curve leaving a hole of smaller diameter than the hollow length inside.

They vary from suppler to supplier. Mine are from Logic rc.. Every so often I prise the ends apart slightly with a kitchen knife to maintain as high a contact pressure as possible. I do this because hhese things, like most model plane stuff today, whoever from, are not of the 'highest possible quality'.

Deans. When soldering the wires on I connect a plug and socket together and lightly clamp the one I am not soldering with a Mole wrench which I then lay flat on thr work surface with a weight on top of thr handles to keep it steady.. Leaving the tags I inted to solder stuck up vertically. I don't have any difficulty soldering. them. I tin the tags first as well a tinning the wire - vertically down to limit the solder creep along the wire.

I use a 100 watt Antex fairly inexpensive non-temperature controlled iron which is not too big and clumsy. 25 watt ones are near-useless for this purpose.

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 31/07/2020 12:12:52

[Andy48]

Posted by perttime on 31/07/2020 06:55:23:

What about small models? Still XT?

Yes, XT30s.

[leccyflyer]

Good points Dick -unfortunately I can see going to 6mm bullets for those heavy current and heavy wire applications, where the 4mm just aren't physically big enough to take the wire.

The only place I have adaptors now is in the charging lead for those aforementioned big chunky blue XT connectors on a couple of packs and, in accordance with your post I didn;t want to cut off the beautiful Astro Zero Loss connectors on my Asstro Wattsmeter, so made up adaptors to connect that to my 4mm bullets. Mostly though I use the clamp meter.

[Paul Marsh]

A guy was flying his Trex 700 electric heli at the field a couple of days ago. he doesn't use a switch for the rx, but an arming xt60 connector.

Sometime in the flight, the heli was flashing. He had one of the battery backers from Optipower fitted and the plug came out, luckily he has the opto unit, which saved the day.

Whatever you do, sods law takes over, so the investment for the backer was a wise one. imagine a 700 heli at full chat going out of control.