Transitioning to a low carbon life

[Jon H]

2 hours ago, Paul De Tourtoulon said:

I don't think that the carbon war is going anywhere, just look at the planes in the sky, and the oil burning cargo ships, too little too late

 

This is a very short sighted perspective. Without oil burning cargo ships our modern world would collapse. The banana you have with your lunch is unlikely to be grown locally and some sort of shipping is going to be needed unless we fancy going back a few hundred years and only eat local/seasonal food.

Also cargo ships and passenger aircraft tend to be very efficient as the shipping company/airline is always looking for ways to save money and cutting a fuel bill is a very easy way to do it. It could be argued i suppose that a flight to somewhere on holiday is not vital and emissions could be cut by not going, but we cant all stay cooped up at home and international travel is here to stay. Although i have to question some of these cruise ships if im honest. 

 

We cannot simply flip a switch and ditch hydrocarbon fuel over night, the technology and infrastructure arent there yet. We can be smarter with how we use it though and use less where possible. 

 

Windmills aren't our saviour as they leave us with loads of composite material we cant recycle and they are flippin eyesore. Solar panels with current tech wont do it either as america for example would need to cover 50% of its land area with panels just to meet current demand. 

 

12 hours ago, Don Fry said:

You want a low carbon future, first step, reduce energy use. So tax SUVS, fast cars, to death. Welcome small horsepower carriers

 

Agreed. My car has a 1.2l turbo petrol, 85hp and it is a more than adequate conveyance for myself, my stuff, and 4 other people should i load them up. I can then set off and not stop for 550miles or so running in the 50's on mpg. The drift towards bigger and heavier cars is not ideal as they require more materials to produce and more energy to move, and this is doubly so for electric due to the weight of the battery. 

 

This is why i think the crop of ev's on the market are, mostly, the wrong type of car. ev's would be excellent for clean air in cities, short trips to the shops, school etc. Trying to make ev's into big luxury cars with long range seems to be the wrong move in my view, and that stupid nissan thing with a petrol engine driving a generator is an insult to anyone who actually studied physics. 

 

3 minutes ago, Shaun Walsh said:

Of course the best way to reduce your carbon footprint is to have no children

 

I would say that population control is a big hurdle. But how do you choose between the human rights of the individual and the human rights of the whole species? 

 

 

I think its safe to say that this climate business is not a simple problem with a simple solution. On the bright side though, the planet will be fine even if we destroy ourselves. The planet is 4.5bn years old, with about the same to go. Humans have been here 200000 years? ish? and we screwed the place up in about 100 years. If we wipe ourselves out the planet will be fine in the end. 

 

[Ron Gray]

@Frank Skilbeckthe charger is Octopus ‘friendly’ (it’s a Zappi) but as I understand it OI needs to communicate with the car so that it can optimise charging based on your driving requirements, network loads / costs etc. The Zappi is programmable so that it knows when to use Solar to charge the car and when are the low cost hours so that is why I am thinking that OGo is the way I should be going.

[Cuban8]

I've had six brand new quality cars over the years and all financed by my employers so I don't get bothered about new cars these days - been there and done it, I suppose. Still have my last company vehicle that I bought for next to nothing at the end of its 4 year contract back in 2012 when I retired early. What does bother me is how my 2.0 TDCi  Mondeo Estate that was pushed as being all nice and environmental and economical at the time is now the villain.

Why should I be forced to pay increasingly large amounts of road tax to punish me for keeping a perfectly good and very well maintained vehicle? Think of the tons of carbon I've prevented from going into the atmosphere by keeping and using the vehicle to it's full potential and not having industry churn out several other vehicles that I could have otherwise acquired (and not really needed TBH) over the last decade or so. They should be paying me not the otherway round!

Older vehicles such as mine are becoming rarer and fading away as they do reach the end of their lives through mainly, I suspect, being uneconomical to repair after a major fault. It's just not classic enough to warrant the advantages that a stinking old  carburettor, non engine management, 'classic' of the 70' enjoys.

Just one observation on the London ULEZ scandal.........my neighbour has a small building business and he finds some of his work within the new outer ULEZ zone. His perfectly good van is not compliant with the new regs.

I asked him what he was going to do. "Just put the extra daily charge on the bill" was his answer. "Another sixty or hundred quid on a job costing several thousands won't be an issue"..................

 

 

[Paul De Tourtoulon]

2 hours ago, Shaun Walsh said:

Of course the best way to reduce your carbon footprint is to have no children. There are already 8 times as many people on the planet than can be sustainably supported in the long term if everyone was to have a European lifestyle.

That's it in a nutshell !.

[MattyB]

3 hours ago, Ron Gray said:

I’m now about to switch to Octopus Go, I did think about Intelligent Octopus but it hasn’t yet got the API to talk to my EV, so should be able to make use of the 9p/kWh low rate to either charge the EV or the solar batteries.

 

That is annoying. When I checked our VW and Zappi combo was ok, but I can see if I change the car to an Ioniq 5 in their compatibility checker it is no longer available; strange given the Hyundai EVs have been so poular. I am thinking about Intelligent as our winter tariff, but may just "go with Go" 😉 as it is simpler to understand and should be easier to get working with the overnight charging I think.

[MattyB]

2 hours ago, Jon - Laser Engines said:

This is why i think the crop of ev's on the market are, mostly, the wrong type of car. ev's would be excellent for clean air in cities, short trips to the shops, school etc. Trying to make ev's into big luxury cars with long range seems to be the wrong move in my view, and that stupid nissan thing with a petrol engine driving a generator is an insult to anyone who actually studied physics. 

 

This is a fair point, but unfortunately the economics mean it is very hard to make small, lightweight, affordable EVs straight off the bat. Whilst less battery material is needed for a small car, everythign else in terms of components is required irrelevent of the car size. for these reasons all the manufacturers have started with larger models where the demand (for now) is higher and margins are greater to help them scale their business, with the idea that smaller, cheaper cars can then follow. Tesla pioneered this model and it has worked well for them; the model 2 is due next year I believe, and they continue to cut the price of existing models on a regular basis as they optimise production. I do appreciate for many the small cheap EVs still seem to be a way off, though at least used prices are now more affordable and supply there is improving.

[MattyB]

3 hours ago, Frank Skilbeck said:

Just replaced our 19yr old Colt with an 18 month old electric Mini, what a hoot to drive and insurance only went up slightly which was a big surprise. Hiccup fitting a wallbox as the Octopus fitter found we are on a looped supply and the main fuse support board had disintegrated, network company coming next week to repair.

 

As for battery recycling, apart from the 1st gen Leafs I understand battery failures are very rare, the main recycling is from accident rightoffs, but they end up in classic car conversions. BTW we talk about battery failure but it's not unkown for ICE engines to fail, friend had the DSG gearbox go faulty in his Fabia, he ended up replacing the car as repair/replacement was expensive. Anybody remember the issues a few years back with dual mass flywheels.

 

Agreed. My old Passat diesel required a new DMF about 20k before I sold it; the fitter said it was basically a standard failure at 60-80k on big diesels. That was a big bill!

Edited August 31, 2023 by MattyB

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

What YOU do is the best way to reduce your carbon footprint, looking for scapegoats is very common and popular, it avoids any feeling that you/I contribute to the problem. You get plenty on the airwaves pointing at others saying it's populations elsewhere "Wot did it" a quick look at the lifestyles of these sages "Populists" tells you why they point the finger. Population has increased over the last X number of years ? Correct, now take an honest look how lifestyles have changed during the same X number of years and draw an "Honest" conclusion.

 

As Jon says above " It's not a simple problem with a simple answer" we screwed the planet up chasing "Stuff".

[MattyB]

3 hours ago, Brian Cooper said:

 

2 hours ago, Learner said:

Our local council has the answer to the car debate.

They build thousands of flats with no parking spaces!

 

2 hours ago, Shaun Walsh said:

Of course the best way to reduce your carbon footprint is to have no children. There are already 8 times as many people on the planet than can be sustainably supported in the long term if everyone was to have a European lifestyle.

 

2 hours ago, Brian Cooper said:

There is a council development in my area like this.  

The truly amazing thing is the councilors keep a dead-straight face when confronted about it. 🤣

 

It is reassuring to know that politicians, from the highest to the lowest, continue to be totally out of touch with reality. 🤦‍♂️

 

Idiots, the lot of them. 

 

Whilst I sympathise with some of these views (especially that politicians are all useless!), can I ask that we try to keep politics out of this thread where we can? I started this topic for people to share and discusse their personal efforts to minimise their carbon consumption, and ideally would like to stick to that where we can. Yes, factors like population control and the climate contribution of aviation and complex global supply chains all contribute far more to the climate crisis than any one of us do as individuals, but those factors are essentially impossible for us to do anything about those factors, other than (maybe) when we vote every 4 years or by choosing not to fly. Many thanks.

 

Right, back to the topic, though obviously if you wish to call me a woke snowflake based on the above please go right ahead, now's your chance... 😉🤣

[Don Fry]

16 minutes ago, MattyB said:

 

This is a fair point, but unfortunately the economics mean it is very hard to make small, lightweight, affordable EVs straight off the bat. Whilst less battery material is needed for a small car, everythign else in terms of components is required irrelevent of the car size. for these reasons all the manufacturers have started with larger models where the demand (for now) is higher and margins are greater to help them scale their business, with the idea that smaller, cheaper cars can then follow. Tesla pioneered this model and it has worked well for them; the model 2 is due next year I believe, and they continue to cut the price of existing models on a regular basis as they optimise production. I do appreciate for many the small cheap EVs still seem to be a way off, though at least used prices are now more affordable and supply there is improving.

But why oh why is it a good idea to give a subsidy to the owner of a 2 1/2 TON SUV, retailing at thick end of a hundred grand. Surely a better system for how taxpayers and air breathers money is spent is a neutral tax, ie tax the climate destroyers, subsidise less polluting behaviours. 
A cynic might suggest the motor industry has sucessfully lobbied governments.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

8 minutes ago, Don Fry said:

But why oh why is it a good idea to give a subsidy to the owner of a 2 1/2 TON SUV, retailing at thick end of a hundred grand. Surely a better system for how taxpayers and air breathers money is spent is a neutral tax, ie tax the climate destroyers, subsidise less polluting behaviours. 
A cynic might suggest the motor industry has sucessfully lobbied governments.

 

You're just one of those Socialists ( Commies). 😉

[MattyB]

13 minutes ago, Don Fry said:

But why oh why is it a good idea to give a subsidy to the owner of a 2 1/2 TON SUV, retailing at thick end of a hundred grand. Surely a better system for how taxpayers and air breathers money is spent is a neutral tax, ie tax the climate destroyers, subsidise less polluting behaviours. 
A cynic might suggest the motor industry has sucessfully lobbied governments.

 

They are expensive I admit, but most EVs are nowhere near £100k, that's just nonsense - the Tesla Model Y starts at £44k now and is the best selling EV in the UK (mainly to company buyers), but there are loads of smaller cheaper ones such as the MGs, BYDs, Fiat 500e etc. 

 

In the UK there are no direct subsidies for plug in vehicles now. The only concessions are zero rated VED (which will disappear too in April 2025), and the BIK breaks for company car drivers who go electric (which on balance I support as they generally do a lot more miles than private drivers). There is no plug in car grant any more, and no financial grant to fund putting in a charger at a private residence.

 

Edited August 31, 2023 by MattyB

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

My car is very very low on emmisions, yet my road tax is high ? It's a year 2000 Honda accord petrol, why is it very very low on emissions, coz of the very very low mileage done.

[MattyB]

12 minutes ago, john stones 1 - Moderator said:

My car is very very low on emmisions, yet my road tax is high ? It's a year 2000 Honda accord petrol, why is it very very low on emissions, coz of the very very low mileage done.

 

Are you advocating for mileage based road pricing? It's almost certainly on the way; Mayor Khan has already been advertising for roles in the TFL road pricing team, despite ruling it out within his tenure...!

Edited August 31, 2023 by MattyB

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

1 minute ago, MattyB said:

 

Are you advocating for mileage based road pricing? It's almost certainly on the way; Mayor Khan has already been advertising for roles in the road pricing scheme despite ruling it out within his tenure...

 

I'm advocating for those that pollute paying the price, seems a fair system to me, very unlikely to go down well with the masses though. Will there be consequences ? Absolutely, as said before, no easy answers.

[MattyB]

8 minutes ago, john stones 1 - Moderator said:

I'm advocating for those that pollute paying the price, seems a fair system to me, very unlikely to go down well with the masses though. Will there be consequences ? Absolutely, as said before, no easy answers.

 

I actually have no problem with mileage based pricing for exactly the reasons you suggest, but only if it is implemented as a total replacement for the current VED system, not in addition to it.

 

Edited August 31, 2023 by MattyB

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

No easy choices Matty, tax on fuel or other methods puts price of goods ups, threatens jobs etc, I suspect the populists will win and fingers will be pointed, those in control of the trough inspire me little.

[Dickw]

Apart from the usual everyday stuff, my main driving requirements are fairly regular 250+ mile round trips to fly my models (competitions and events) and a weekly trip into London.

 

I would really love an electric car and have done research and had test drives, but I can't find one I can afford that will carry my models and gear and do a guaranteed 250 miles plus at "motorway" speeds. Stopping to charge is not really an option as they are long enough days already.

In short, neither the range nor the charging infrastructure are yet sufficient for me to make the move.

 

I have a 12 year old diesel estate which I have been hanging on to for several years in the hope the EV situation would improve, but have decided to give up waiting and am now in the process of replacing it with a newer (only a couple of years old) ULEZ compliant model. With luck the situation will have improved in favour of electric in a few years time when I will consider changing again.

 

I have no problem with mileage based road pricing as my overall mileage is not particularly high.

 

Dick

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

I'm very pessemistic on this topic, the impact change will have on people will be resisted fiercely, change will need to be forced upon us and I don't see Worldwide leadership to do it Fake news reigns supreme.

 

Pretty much on same page as Don, Mother Nature will have the final word.

[Learner]

My local garage has a 2015 renault zoe for £7495 with 59000 miles on the clock

Some may think a reasonable price if you wanted to get into EV

Would I buy it, No! 

No battery warranty left, probably had  at least 500 charges.

Unlike Matty I wouldn't be confident the battery would last many more years.

An i.c car of that age mileage should do another 100000 miles/10 yrs at least.

If the  AA or similar started testing and stating projected battery lifespan/ mileage left and that was given when buying second hand I may change my mind, otherwise its a £2000 car.

 

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Informed opinion seems to be tending towards a useable battery life, for sensibly charged systems, approaching 200000 miles or 20 years.  Time will tell of course…

[EvilC57]

5 hours ago, Shaun Walsh said:

Of course the best way to reduce your carbon footprint is to have no children. There are already 8 times as many people on the planet than can be sustainably supported in the long term if everyone was to have a European lifestyle.

Agreed. However if no one has any children in future, who’s going to pay us oldies state pensions?!

[Jon H]

1 hour ago, Martin Harris - Moderator said:

Informed opinion seems to be tending towards a useable battery life, for sensibly charged systems, approaching 200000 miles or 20 years.  Time will tell of course…

 

I will believe that when i see it. If they can do it then great, but so far i think 5-10 years even is pushing your luck given the evidence so far. Those early Nissan leaf's have certainly wilted somewhat and its more costly to fix than to throw the car away. Clearly the RnD wasnt up to scratch on that one. 

[Nigel R]

28 minutes ago, Jon - Laser Engines said:

 

I will believe that when i see it. If they can do it then great, but so far i think 5-10 years even is pushing your luck given the evidence so far. Those early Nissan leaf's have certainly wilted somewhat and its more costly to fix than to throw the car away. Clearly the RnD wasnt up to scratch on that one. 

 

Nissan did very little battery management and zero cooling in the early Leaf, so that's kind of reverse cherry picking... literally the worst case 🙃 

 

3 hours ago, MattyB said:

Agreed. My old Passat diesel required a new DMF about 20k before I sold it; the fitter said it was basically a standard failure at 60-80k on big diesels. That was a big bill!

 

But at the same time you also had your clutch done. Or at least you should have. And most of that cost will have been the labour in dropping the box to get to the flywheel.

 

We had our diesel Passat's DMF and clutch changed about a year ago, and it's at around 130k now, so I guess both lasted until 120k miles for us.

[Jon H]

5 minutes ago, Nigel R said:

Nissan did very little battery management and zero cooling in the early Leaf, so that's kind of reverse cherry picking... literally the worst case

 

kinda my point. If they can screw it up once...