Brown paper as a covering material

[Ron Gray]

A forum member suggested that I put my video on covering using brown paper under a separate topic as he couldn’t find it on my YouTube channel, so here it is. This would also be a great place to submit all of your tips when using this covering material.

 

Plus here are the ones specifically related to the WR FW190

 

 

 

[Robin Colbourne]

Thank you for posting these videos Ron, its a topic in which I am very interested.

[Basil]

1 hour ago, Robin Colbourne said:

Thank you for posting these videos Ron, its a topic in which I am very interested.

Yes thanks Ron.

Bas

 

[john davidson 1]

Thanks  Ron. Just wondering if this could be adapted  to depron?  Balsa veneer is stuck to foam cores with PVA , or perhaps use water based varnish .  I do use vinyl from the local sign shop which makes the wing almost bomb proof but brown  paper would be cheaper and also sandable and would take emulsion .  Worth a try any way 

[Engine Doctor]

Hi Ron . The last model I covered in brown paper was a DB Hurticane I built for a friend. I found that the brown parcel paper sold at the Post office that had a sort grain along it was very good . I used to paste it with slightly dilute PVA and let it soak like wall paper. It would then take a compound curve very well . Balsa sheet was given a couple of coats of thinned dope to A raise the grain and B seal it slightly.  It dried very strong . One thing I found was NOT to use cheap PVA like n*  n***ense type home brands. Its good to keep these skills and tips alive . Well done Ron.

Edited March 19 by Engine Doctor

[Lipo Man]

37 minutes ago, john davidson 1 said:

Thanks  Ron. Just wondering if this could be adapted  to depron?  Balsa veneer is stuck to foam cores with PVA , or perhaps use water based varnish .  I do use vinyl from the local sign shop which makes the wing almost bomb proof but brown  paper would be cheaper and also sandable and would take emulsion .  Worth a try any way 

Here is my simple EDF design. It’s made of domestic insulation foam from B&Q (therefore very similar to depron, I think) and it’s covered with brown paper then painted. I did it as an experiment, but it worked pretty well. I didn’t use heat to activate the PVA - it just air-dried. 
 

[chris collis]

My last two Lancasters were covered with brown parcel paper applied onto the veneer with slightly watered down Pva .Then a thin coating to the paper and slowly laid onto the airframe,gently pressing out any air bubbles.Very strong when dry and any overlaps can be lightly sanded. The paint was applied thinly for the first coat and then thicker for the second and third coats. I found it was a good cheap way for covering large models.

[Jim Hearnden 1]

Years ago I used to cut my own cores. For smaller stuff used brown paper & paper based (not mylar) gift wrapping paper. 

The latter is what Mick Reeves used on his Disco. Water based PVA worked well & overlaps can be sanded to feather. 

On small (36") span bare foam cores it works well. I used tissue soaked in PVA as wing joiners for these as well. 

[Paul De Tourtoulon]

Nothing new, over here they have been using it for over 30 years and still do, I think that they use watered down white glue to put it on.

[Ron Gray]

@Paul De TourtoulonNobody is saying that it's new Paul but a lot of people haven't seen it before so that is why I created this topic hoping that members would add useful comments!

 

To the rest - keep the tips coming through guys, it's turning into a useful 'Wiki' type thread.

[Brian Cooper]

Brown paper works well as a covering material. 

It is brilliant for strengthening foam cores. . . I use wallpaper paste on mine.

 

When covering foam, be aware that if using any adhesive with water in it, there will be shrinkage so apply to all sides at the same time or there will be warping. 

[Engine Doctor]

On scale models , panel lines can be created by simply cutting the brown paper to the size of the panel and glueing over a base covering. The overlap edge simulates panels very realistically. I used this on the frontvof the Hurricane fuz. The stringered part was first covered in tex then thebrown paper overlapped by an inch . Scale panels were then glued on top of the base paper layer. Extrat weight ? In the case of the DB Hurricane the nose needs all the help it can get to balance the tail section. When dried i sealed the surface with a coat of non shrinking dope followed by a light sand . Rivets applied by using thick cyano through a pipette tip guided by a ruler or light pencil line. Then painted using whaterver paint suits . Very realistic ,cheap ,strong and easy to clean up. Glass epoxy is good but expensive ,more difficilt to clean up and no quicker plus temperature has to be kept warm to assure a  cure. 

Many american kits supplied  foam blanks with thick brown paper/card for covering . I used to discard the card and use balsa but after using brown paper im rwally ompressed.

Ron it may be obvious to us but for begginers it is important to stress that brown paper is only siutable for covering sheeted areas. I have in the past seen attempts from newcomers and not so newcomers to cover open structure 😶 . It doesnt work.

Edited March 20 by Engine Doctor

[Futura57]

I have to agree that brown paper is a great covering material. I've known about it for donkey's years but never seriously considered using it until  recently. Since I started using depon and similar foam sheet material for building models, I have found brown paper to be something of a revelation. It works out a few pennies per metre and is readily available. A bit like applying very thick tissue.  I use Titebond wood adhesive because it sands really well. Some PVA glues stay rubbery when dry. It is a lighter and significantly cheaper alternative to skinning a foam surface with balsa. And is surprisingly strong. For open structures I am happy using 38 micro matt laminating film.

 

Edited March 20 by Futura57

[Ron Gray]

4 hours ago, Engine Doctor said:

it is important to stress that brown paper is only siutable for covering sheeted areas.

Good point ED!

[Keith Billinge]

I'm going to buy some brown paper but there's loads of choice on Amazon.

They seem to vary from 85g/sm to about 100g/sm what would you suggest is a decent place to start? They also vary wildly in price.

 

KB

 

 

[Ron Gray]

80 g/m2 should be good enough for our needs. This one looks OK.

[leccyflyer]

I just bought a couple of the rolls from Hobbycraft this afternoon - the stuff that Ron was using in the vlog build of the FW190.

[Erfolg]

Ron has pointed out that nothing is new or is being claimed.

 

This is my old contribution, in the good old days of Barcs and 100s, there was at least one kit that used "Blue Foam" for wings, uncovered. It was common practice to use "Christmas type present wrapping Paper", using simple PVA. The arrangement was incredibly strong. I do not remember what was used to protect the paper, there was no WBV back then. Protections was necessary as comps were run even when raining, paper does not like being wet. I had a conventional wing pop (under a monster tow), due to a day of being wet during a comp (it was covered with a plastic sheet), Damp weather in the past could soften PVA.

 

With respect PVA, it seems that in essence it is like saying steel, could be a low carbon, high carbon,  or with alloys. PVA know seems to be so broad, that it is difficult to predict how different, under what circumstances. An example is a PVA (D4) I have used (recently)will not be reactivated if heated with a iron, to use to reseal iron on film. In the past basic PVA could be used for the purpose. At present I use Gorilla white (PVA), because I can easily purchase it, not sure it dilutes well, though. Experimentation may be required.

 

[Keith Billinge]

Thanks for that Gents Six and a half quid for 50Meters.....Better than the crazy prices for covering film!

[GrumpyGnome]

I think the Phoenix 100 (Neville Mattingley?) was uncovered blue foam..

[kc]

Keith B  did you see the reviews that said that paper smells a lot ?  Somebody said like kippers!    Maybe your wife would not let in the house! 

 

See you at the flying field over the weekend I hope. 

[Andrew Douglas]

Hi Ron

thanks for bringing this method into the spotlight. I have just covered a Cambrian gunfighter Hurricane using this method and I am astounded at the strength and surface quality . I’m wondering if anyone has tried it on open frame wings /fuselages and how well it works in that situation 

[Ron Gray]

Do not use it on open structures as there is no strength in the covering itself it just provides a shell to the surface being covered.

[Keith Billinge]

I wonder if it would work on open structures if you covered them in Doculam first. That might be worth a try?

Anyone tried this yet?

 

KB

[leccyflyer]

You're relying on the Doculam to do the work of strengthening the open structure and providing the air-tightness required for flight. The brown paper in that case is essentially acting as super heavyweight tissue over Doculam and just providing a nice base for paint. Unless you are using it to replicate panel lines there doesn't seem to be much benefit compared to using  tissue or a suitable primer as the base for a paint and you're really just adding weight.