So called " Driving aids" on new cars , help or hinderence ?

[Paul De Tourtoulon]

4 hours ago, Engine Doctor said:

Later a Dynostart was made and fitted as standard...luxury !

 

2 hours ago, Phil Green said:

The Bond version of the 4T had two opposing sets of points, allowing the engine to be stopped and restarted in reverse, to allow you to reverse the car - bike engines of course having only forward gears, no reverse.

That's what I had on my one in Brightlingsea, Dynastart and the 4 forward and reverse gears, funny thing it ran better in reverse. One of the workers had the 250cc twin, pure luxury.

[Cuban8]

Talk of Phil's Bond Minicar reminds me of my dad's ancient Reliant back in the early 60's - not a plastic one of later years but an aluminium body and soft top from the early 50's or before  more than likely. Was fairly reliable and I clearly recall travelling miles in it as a very young kid and also getting to grips with engines and their maintenance. Anyway, loads of anecdotes that I could bore everyone with...... but I will mention that on one Sunday morning, dad went to drive around the corner to get his papers but found that the Reliant was gone from outside..........never one to get excited or stressed out over much, he just wandered around to get his Sunday papers and await events.

He came back with the papers under his arm with the news that the Reliant was a couple of hundred yards down the road, either broken down or abandoned in disgust by the yobs who nicked it. Collected it after lunch IIRC😁

 

Edited August 14, 2024 by Cuban8

[Engine Doctor]

Great remenice Phil   .those 250 twins were silky smooth and quite piwerful tor the time.

I was given a Triumph Tiger Cub with no engine. I fitted , with the help of a wirk mate an Excelsior 250 twin. Great little bike .

Cant imagine doing that now as everthing has to have modules to run. 

I think we had the best of times .

[Don Fry]

Don’t knock cars today. 
I went to a road crash, Lamborghini,, skid lines said over limit, but my inner child said, “ why buy one of they, if you don’t want to find out if the performance figures are correct”. Problems started, it split, just aft of the upper seat belt anchorage, chucking him out at speed. 
A few years later, I went to a road crash, mid size car. “Swear word” says I, as I saw what state that car was in. Empty car, “who’s the driver”, and a young lady leaves the crowd. “You ok”, “yes, but the seat belt has hurt my shoulder.”

[payneib]

Dead thread revival! But in my defence, I've just bought a new (to me) car, and I've got a fresh comparison between a relatively basic "old" (2015) car and modern tech.

 

First of all, it's electric. Electric driving is unreal. You can glide along silently, but for those who've ridden motorcycles with decent power, the best comparison is when you're sat in 2nd or 3rd gear, holding the throttle just waiting for a ballistic overtake - it's that, but all the time. And all for 1/5 the cost of petrol commuting.

 

The driving aids themselves seem to be geared towards good, modern roads, especially motorways. 

 

Adaptive cruise control - radar follows the car in front. I've used it in traffic, and it's brilliant, but not much use in the country. I imagine it's great on the M1 at rush hour.

 

Lane follow assist - again, great in traffic (the combination of the two is basically auto pilot), but not much use where the lanes are thin, or markings covered/non existent.

 

Cross traffic detection - let's you know if anything is approaching from the sides as you reverse out of a space and it's brilliant.

 

The one I hate though, is "lane keep assist" - where it detects the centre line and edge of the road, then nudges you back if you stray too far. I'm sure this is fantastic on good, modern roads, especially motorways (but to be honest, I'd be more likely to use LFA as above), but on country roads where you need to use more of the lane, or the lines disappear, or the road isn't a standard width (so 90% of my driving), it's lethal. A computer grabbing the wheel off you as you line up a corner is the last thing you need on a dark morning getting to work. And thanks to "that ther' guvment' it turns itself back on every time you start the car. The good news is, I've found the shortcut button to turn it off every time I get in, and don't need to keep going through the main menu. 

[Ron Gray]

12 minutes ago, payneib said:

The one I hate though, is "lane keep assist"

Yep, that's the one that gets switched off each time I start, I think EU (?) laws state that the it must default to ON, which is a shame but not a big issue.

[leccyflyer]

The lane assist function on mine doesn't actually take control, just gives a warning judder if you go over the lines. I would have liked to have such a thing years ago to prevent falling asleep at the wheel and drifting out of lane on long overnight trips, but it's just an irritation now and is switched off. Thankfully it doesn't default to On, its just activated by a wee rocker switch on the end of the indicator stalk. I'd imagine that the more active lane keep assist described above would be an absolute menace on the country roads that I do most of my driving on these days.

[payneib]

I think I can change it to a "warning", and maybe that'll be less intrusive and save me turning it off every time, but then I'll have the car pinging at me every 400 yards as I line up for the next bend. I ended up right across the centre line on Friday morning, as it stopped me going wide on the corner entrance, then stopped me going tight at the apex, and couldn't recover on the exit (winding country road with clear visibility along/through all the corners for reference, so I knew it was clear).

[Ron Gray]

14 minutes ago, leccyflyer said:

The lane assist function on mine doesn't actually take control, just gives a warning judder if you go over the lines

Mine is similar although you do need to put in a bit of effort to overcome it (unless you indicate)! The lane follow option is more like auto pilot and is very good on most (not country lanes) roads but does warn you if you take your hands off the wheel for too long. I do use both functions when on major roads but that doesn't happen that often!

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Happily, I can turn my lane keeping off - either temporarily or on a “default” basis on my MG5. I don’t know when any legislation compelled it to be otherwise - my car is less than two years old. 
 

I did play with it at first - the nudging on crossing a lane boundary is subtle enough and easily corrected but I didn’t like the lack of direct steering feel that resulted from lane following although it was quite amusing to use both where, apart from being nagged to hold the wheel (my hands were never more than relaxed around it) the experience of autonomous driving was pretty impressive. 
 

I do use ACC extensively, both for open road cruising and in low speed queues, where it’s known as Traffic Jam Assist.

[Brian Cooper]

My (1 year old) Nissan Qashqai has two "Lane Keeping" assisting systems. 

The first one is the usual "around town" system which detects changing lanes without indicating. It also detects pedestrians stepping off kerbs... It is also has amusing responses to BMWs cutting in front of the car. . . No problem, it works well. 

 

And then there's the other system... 

"Steering Assist" for use when the cruise control is activated. 

It is supposed to maintain the vehicle in its lane. 

However, my one wanders about in the lane, weaving gracefully between the lines of the lane. Anybody following would assume I am drunk. 

 

Nissan has checked it over and, with the usual response to cars under warranty, was told, "There is nothing wrong with it, sir." 

When I told them I have had other cars with this system and they all worked perfectly, their response was, "Ahh, but they weren't Nissan cars were they.." 

 

So there we have it. . I have the pinnacle of Nissan excellence with "Wander-matic" steering with Cruise Control activated. Thank goodness it can be turned off. 

 

I strongly suspect it will only be recognised as a fault when the warranty expires. 

 

[john davidson 1]

As mentioned above many of these functions are required by EEC regs. But having to adjust say heater temp via a menu  instead of a button is  distracting. New car sales are reported as stalling  , I suspect because of the price hikes due to increase in the the electronic fit in the recent past and car residuals are worse too,

 

Reading a test of the latest Tesla  the tester was appalled by the indicator stalk being replaced by a button on the steering wheel spoke, so that when preparing to exit a roundabout for example , the button was on the other side. Might have made sense in a showroom but utterly impracticable. Of course roundabouts are rare or unknown in America ( I thnk)

[Engine Doctor]

Some driving aids really are helpful for instance, Parking sensors and rear view cameras  especially for modern cars with plastic bumpers, self releasing electric handbrake that release when you press the accelerator , auto light and windscreen wipers . You don't realise how useful these aids are until you step back in time and drive  an older car . My pet car driven occasionally,  is just in the classic bracket at 26 yrs old and while brilliant to drive, I  do have to really think when manoeuvring in a tight space that no beep will warn me of obstacles  or when pulling away remember to let off the hand brake  as I have got so used to these aids on my daily drive.

As for lane assist etc do we really need these gimmicks . Lets face it if anyone needs lane assist while driving they shouldn't be driving .

Gimmicks being forced on us by EU and nany state. 

Alternating between old and modern is a bit like when 2.4 came in . I still had a few models on 35 until one day after using the 2.4 for a time I took my 35 meg model up and suddenly realised its loss of control was due to the aerial not being pulled up 😳. I did manage to pull aerial up without ripping it from the TX and saved the model 

[Engine Doctor]

14 minutes ago, john davidson 1 said:

As mentioned above many of these functions are required by EEC regs. But having to adjust say heater temp via a menu  instead of a button is  distracting. New car sales are reported as stalling  , I suspect because of the price hikes due to increase in the the electronic fit in the recent past and car residuals are worse too,

 

Reading a test of the latest Tesla  the tester was appalled by the indicator stalk being replaced by a button on the steering wheel spoke, so that when preparing to exit a roundabout for example , the button was on the other side. Might have made sense in a showroom but utterly impracticable. Of course roundabouts are rare or unknown in America ( I thnk)

Agreed . Too many of the cars imported into the Uk or even made here are all geared up for left hand drive .

 

The Road Vehicle Construction and Use act 1986 should prohibit these silly/ dangerous  ideas from being allowed on our roads, 

I read it somewhere that the large touch screens used for everything in a car were being looked at by VDSA as it as dangerous to use those while driving as it is using a mobile phone  .

[Tim Kearsley]

23 hours ago, john davidson 1 said:

Reading a test of the latest Tesla  the tester was appalled by the indicator stalk being replaced by a button on the steering wheel spoke, so that when preparing to exit a roundabout for example , the button was on the other side. Might have made sense in a showroom but utterly impracticable. Of course roundabouts are rare or unknown in America ( I thnk)

Absolutely agree 100%.  Back in June I test drove the new (so-called "Highland") Tesla Model 3 Performance.  Much about the car was superb but the absence of indicators on a stalk was a deal-breaker for me.  I had the car for an hour and deliberately took it on a route with several roundabouts.  It's utterly useless in my opinion as the indicator button, when you want to indicate that you are about to leave the roundabout, is at some indeterminate position. The Tesla fan-boys say that you'll get used to it but why should you need to "get used to it"?  Tesla has always been USA-centric though and, as you say, not many roundabouts in that country.

 

 

Edited November 5, 2024 by Beth Ashby Moderator

[Frank Skilbeck]

3 hours ago, Engine Doctor said:

 

As for lane assist etc do we really need these gimmicks . Lets face it if anyone needs lane assist while driving they shouldn't be driving .

 😳. 

Yep, but wish the Volvo that came over the white line and wrote my BMW 520 6 years ago had it.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

I've started wearing my automatic welding mask when driving, deals with the crazy LEDs and stops me smoking. 🌞

[IDD15]

You could not make this up…😈

 

smart summon upgrade

 

Tesla nil points!

 

idd

[EvilC57]

10 hours ago, IDD15 said:

You could not make this up…😈

 

smart summon upgrade

 

Tesla nil points!

 

idd

Not so smart then 😑.

[Tim Kearsley]

12 hours ago, IDD15 said:

You could not make this up…😈

 

smart summon upgrade

 

Tesla nil points!

 

idd

Having owned two Tesla Model 3s over the last four years, that doesn't surprise me at all.  It's quite common for an OTT software update to be sent out to the cars, only for it to be pulled a day later or followed immediately by a patch, to fix bugs the update introduced.  Also, in those four years of ownership and dozens of software updates, the auto-wipers are yet to work properly.  This is because of Musk's insistence that everything on the car must work via vision - so he eschews the use of a 20p rain sensor in favour of using the front cameras and neural nets to detect rain on the screen.  The result is that they work beautifully in some lighting conditions and not at all in others - useless!  Likewise the removal of ultrasonic parking sensors in favour of a vision-based solution and the removal of the front radar in favour of vision.  I really feel for the people in this country who shelled out another almost £7K for "full self-driving" which does..... nothing at all!

 

[payneib]

18 hours ago, Engine Doctor said:

Lets face it if anyone needs lane assist while driving they shouldn't be driving 

 

Just discovered another feature of my new Kona - back seat occupancy warning. If it detects weight on the back seat when you turn the car off, it gives a "check back seat" warning on the dash. I'm assuming so people don't forget their children!

 

These aids really are aimed at the lowest common denominator of drivers. 🤣

[J D 8 - Moderator]

  Four of us went up to Much Marcle show in a club members Nissan Juke. As we set off it kept telling us to put our seatbelts on. Gordon and myself sat in the back, "we have" we said. Turned out Gordon's little haversack on the middle seat also needed its seat belt on.😁

       Thing I would find distracting if driving was the large colour screen in middle of the dash, on map mode it was as if you were flying along in a helicopter at about 500 feet above looking forward and down from the cockpit. Swear I saw more of what sort of country I was passing through than looking out the window!

[leccyflyer]

THink I've mentioned it before, but the detector which allows the sounding of the passenger seat belt alarm ping had me flummoxed a while back. As the temperature was around freezing I have my lipo bag in a cool bag, with a hot water bottle and put that on the heated passenger seat. That was fine and keeps the lipos at a nice temperature. However once I go onto the country roads, at the tighter bends I would get a momentary ping from the car, but by the time I looked down there was nothing displayed. Finally figured it out on a more sustained bend that it was the passenger seat belt alarm and the wight of the lipo bag was just sufficient to indicate the seat was occupied, but only with the extra, small increase in apparent weight caused when going around a bend. So now the lipo bag has it's seat belt on for the trip.

[IDD15]

My Born is the first car I’ve ever had that has an automatic dipping rear view mirror, absolutely brilliant piece of kit. Just so much easier and safer than taking a hand off the wheel to reach up and operate a clunky lever. Should be mandatory on all cars IMHO.

 

cheers

idd

[GrumpyGnome]

Gosh, I had auto dipping mirrors donkeys years ago, on a Ford Focus - think an Audi and VW had them too. Yes, they are great - needed even more thanks to the 'brighter than the sun' LEDs that permanently dazzle me........